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could be a possibility thats her marriage what about a death have you tried that

Long shot for Mary Alice in 1911

Name: Elsie Alice Hodgkinson
Age in 1911: 20
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1891
Relation to Head: Servant
Gender: Female
Birth Place: United States
Civil parish: Accrington
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street Address: 5 Johns Vicarage, Accrington
Marital Status: Single
Occupation: General Servant Domestic
Registration district: Haslingden
Registration District Number: 471
Sub-registration district: Accrington
ED, institution, or vessel: 29
Household schedule number: 224
Piece: 24777
Household Members:
Name Age
James William Wilkinson 46
Annie Wilkinson 46
Alice Marione Wilkinson 6
Florence Gertrude Salisbury 21
Elsie Alice Hodgkinson 20
Mary Tettrey 52
Ellen Grace Pakes

Pauline, I know we are not having much success in finding your great-grandmother but could you please reply to us on the thread?

Also you have marked Batman's daughter's 1871 census post as answered - which marks the whole thread as answered. So anyone looking who has not already contributed will not bother looking for the real answer you are after because they will think it has already been found :-(

Thank you for all your help, I am just sifting through all the replys so far. I am amazed at the size of the response!!!

ChristianaS and Janice both have given me some further information:- Charles Hodgkinson returned to Liverpool on the ADRIA ion 2nd October 1898 aged 33yrs and as a labourer. He brought 3 children back:-
Mary Alice aged 8, Charles Wilfred aged 6 and Minnie aged 1/2 Minnie's birthday is 14/09/1897 so she would have been just over a year old when they arrived back in Liverpool. All three children are USA/British and both Charles and Minnie born in Baltimore Maryland. My nan was quite proud of being born in Baltimore bless her.Charles married Margaret Kirfoot on the 05/04/1899. By 1901 census Charles and Minnie in Chorley work house (paupers) and Mary Alice in Ophanage aged 10yrs. Why they were split up I don't know I didn't know of Mary's existence until ChristinaS and Janice gave me the information. I do know that in the 1911 census Minnie @ 13yrs was a patient in the City of Liverpool Infectious deseases hospital in Fazakeley. (place of birth Philadelphia USA?) I think they have got mixed up with the birth place and departure place. Unfortunately my nan and indeed all my mothers familty never talked about family history so I have had to piece each bit to the other. I really hope you can help me further and I do so thank you for all your help thus far. Kind Regards Pauline

Marieceleste

So sorry I am a bit unsure as to how to reply to and I think I clicked on the wrong thing and possibly knocked Batman I am so sorry. I have been replying to you but I think the replies must be going to your e-mail account, I have just found the @add your reply@ at the bottom of this thread so here hoping I have go it right. I am as I have said sifting through all the information - some I already knew (it is always good to know that I have got the right infor myself) but don't let that put anyone off because I am so grateful for all the information. Also as I come accross your replies I am trying to look up the information myself especially regarding Mary Alice I don't know she existed. My searches as hampered also because all my mother's (Minnie's daughter) have died so again thank you.

HeyJudeB4Beatles don't think for one moment you are not doing a first rate job - I really appreciate everything.

Pauline - I've looked through the USA 1900 census, but am unable to find any of the family I mentioned earlier. That is - Charles, Martha/Rose, T.W. and M.A. Hodgekinson.

So I'm wondering if this family also left the USA between 1888 and 1900.

I think it's quite a coincidence, despite the birthdate of M.A. being 2 years out.

Have you been able to find Mary Alice after 1901, to see whereabouts she was born? Or maybe the first M.A. died and they had Mary Alice later.

Charles's twin brother Samuel emigrated to USA in 1885 on the vessel Baltic arriving in New York 03/0/85 Just wondered if Charles had followed him. That is of course if I have the correct information for Samuel

Minnies forenames are Minnie Alvina if that helps

Minnie wasn't born until 1897, so the child with the initials M.A. can't be her. They're more likely to be her older sister, Mary Alice.

Pauline - thank you!

OK - some questions:

Who did Minnie marry? Probably won't help but you never know.

There is someone else on GR has her in his tree (Peter Harvey) are you in touch?

I can see now that Samuel and Charles were twins - hadn't twigged that. Another line to follow. Are you aware of when Charles might have died? It seems that he was still alive in 1901 as Margaret is married but I cannot find him.

I wonder if Mary Alice was split up from the other two because she was over 10? I assume they were put into care sometime between 1899 and 1901.

This is Charles' and Martha Rose's marriage

spouse: Martha Rosanea Griffith
groom: Chas Hodgkinson
bride: Martha Rosanea Griffith
marriage type: Marriage
marriage date: 1886
marriage place: Jefferson, West Virginia, United States
digital folder number: 4130812
source: County Records

I don't think this is them. There is another child born (T.W.) in 1887

Jude

This is Samuel


name: Samuel Hodgkinson
event: Naturalization
event date: 1896
event place: Maine
birth year: 1865
birthplace: Chorley, England
nara publication title: Index to New England Naturalization Petitions, 1791-1906
nara publication number: M1299
nara roll number: 75
digital folder number:

and in 1910

spouse: Annie Hodgkinson
child: Emery E Hodgkinson
name: Samuel Hodgkinson
birthplace: England
relationship to head of household: Self
residence: Belfast Ward 1, Waldo, Maine
marital status: Married
race : White
gender: Male
father's birthplace: England
mother's birthplace: England
family number: 271
page number: 10

Minnie's marriage?

Name: Minnie Elvina Hodgkinson
Birth Year: abt 1898
Age: 23
Marriage Date: 23 Mar 1921
Parish: Wavertree St Bridget
Spouse's Name: Robert O'Donnell
Father's Name: Charles Hodgkinson
Spouse Father's Name: Robert O'Donnell

and Minnie's death

Name: Minnie Elvina O'Donnell
Birth Date: 14 Sep 1897
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1981
Age at Death: 84
Registration district: Liverpool
Inferred County: Merseyside
Volume: 36
Page: 0583

Robert died in 1949 - Minnie granted probate

Don't know if the Maryland State Archives would be able to help:
http://guide.mdsa.net/index.cfm

They have all sorts of records and indices listed but nothing available to search on-line. They do seem to have a collection of Baltimore City birth records 1875 to 1972. There's an email address [email protected] that might be useful to contact to ask for advice.

Searching at:
https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/list#page=1®ion=UNITED_STATES

groom: Chas Hodgkinson
groom's age: [22]
groom's estimated birth year:
groom's birthplace: [Edgehill]
bride: Martha Rosanea Griffith
bride's age: [24]
bride's birthplace: [Clarke Co VA]
marriage type: Marriage
marriage date: 1886 [Sept 1st]
marriage place: Jefferson, West Virginia, United States [New Duffield]
groom's marital status: [Single]
bride's marital status: [Single]
film number: 829872
digital folder number: 4130812
image number: 00508
source: County Records
Source Citation
"West Virginia, Marriages, 1853-1970," index, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FRT1-XBS : accessed 13 Aug 2012), Chas Hodgkinson and Martha Rosanea Griffith, 1886.

[There's a remark - Consent ... Bride's Father ... Wonder what the age of consent was for women in WV back then]


name: M.A. Hodgkinson
birth date: 05 Nov 1888
birthplace: Shenandoah Junct, Jefferson Co, West Virginia
gender: Female
father's name: Charles Hodgkinson
father's birthplace: Lancastor Co, Eng
father's age: 24 years
mother's name: Rose Griffith Hodgkinson
mother's birthplace: Clarke Co, Va
mother's age: 27 years
film number: 829325
digital folder number: 4003321
image number: 123
reference number: 44-45
source: County Records
Source Citation
"West Virginia Births, 1853-1930," index, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/F153-B8J : accessed 13 Aug 2012), M.A. Hodgkinson, 05 Nov 1888.

name: T.W. Hodgkinson
birth date: 15 Jul 1887
birthplace: Shenandoah Junct, Jefferson Co, West Virginia
gender: Male
father's name: Chas. Hodgkinson
father's birthplace: Lancasshire, Eng.
father's age: 23 years
mother's name: Martha R. Griffith Hodgkinson
mother's birthplace: Clarke Co, Va
mother's age: 26 years
film number: 829325
digital folder number: 4003321
image number: 110
reference number: 18-19
source: County Records
Source Citation
"West Virginia Births, 1853-1930," index, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/F153-P8Q : accessed 13 Aug 2012), T.W. Hodgkinson, 15 Jul 1887.

You can click on the view image link to left of transcription - it's free!!


Shenandoah Junction is abt 10km W of Harpers Ferry [of John Brown's body fame]
It's almost as far E as you can go in WV.
Clarke Co VA is the adjacent county to SSW.


1880 United States Federal
Home in 1880: Battletown, Clarke, Virginia
Thomas W. Griffith 48
Martha A. Griffith 48
Martha R. Griffith 18
Joseph B. Griffith 15
James H. Griffith 13
John Wm Griffith 9
Charles E. Griffith 7
Thomas R. Griffith 3
Sarah A. 1
Source Citation: Year: 1880; Census Place: Battletown, Clarke, Virginia; Roll: 1360; Family History Film: 1255360; Page: 380A; Enumeration District: 030; .


Magnify 4 clicks, then save image:
http://archive.org/stream/populationschedu1641unit#page/n7/mode/1up
http://archive.org/stream/10thcensus1360unit#page/n770/mode/1up

Interesting to note the change in name for Martha

from Martha Rosanea Griffith

to Martha Griffith Hodgkinson

to Martha R. Griffith Hodgkinson




and a possible explanation .................

I lived in Texas in the late 1960s, and women there dropped a middle name when they married and replaced it with their maiden name.


In fact, I acquired a middle name in the eyes of the university where I worked ........... I only have one forename, but they assigned my maiden name as my second forename :-D



so the loss of Rosanea and replacement with Griffith was just part of the tradition, and maybe even legally required, in WV, and the southern US.





sylvia

I am still not convinced this is them.

Charles' age is not quite right for starters - if he was 22 in September 1886 then that makes it 1864. His and Samuel's birth was registered in June 1865.

Birthplace Edgehill - assuming this is in Lancashire (as evidenced by the births) this could be Ormskirk way. There is a Hodgkinson born Ormskirk but he's an Albert Edward :-(

So if M.A. was Mary Alice and age is wrong - she was allegedly 8 when they returned in 1898. Who is TW? Is there a death to match?

And why can't we find Charles Wilfred and Minnie Alvina - who were definitely born Baltimore.

Needs some more digging!

I would also guess those two children are named after her parents i.e. Martha A and Thomas W

Jude