Genealogy Chat

Have just spent hours and hours and more hours searching and now my neck is aching my eyes are so tired words going in to one, can anyone give a bit of advise on how I may be able to find them, they are The Howells family from Cardiff 1932 Ada Jane Pirie ( formally Howells) dies and is buried with her son who died in infancy also on headstone its mentioned her son who died in India 1907 ,obituary in local paper says three remaining children still alive Florence Ada ( Flossie) Mabel Jane ( Mabs) and William Albert G ( Billy). when Florence dies in 1975 age 91 it says Mabs and late brother Billy, no husbands or wives are mentioned, so I have searched for a marriage for Mabel Jane from 1910 when she would have been 17 up to 1925 when she would have been over 30 and have looked for her death after 1975 and also one for Billy after 1932 and still found nothing i have been looking at both Howell and Howells so any ideas anyone Thanks for any tips Pam

I assume that you have the family on 1901 Pam? Was the brother who died in India the one listed just as F A Howells? I see that William was 14 and Mabel 7 in 1901. Unfortunately I am just off to bed and busy tomorrow but I hope someone can help. Chrissie

Hi, I am slightly confused. Florence Ada Howells was born 5/10/1883 and died Jun qtr 1975, she obviously had never married. Who is Ada Jane Pirie (formerly Howells), was she their mother who then remarried? Where did she die? I can't find a death in 1932. Are we looking for them in Wales? Mabel Jane Howells dob approx 1893 & William Albert G Howells dob approx 1887. Does this look right? You need either a marriage or death for the two other siblings. Sorry but I didn't understand your message, bit late at night. Steph

So sorry said I was tired and confused, Hi Chrissie Yes that the right family and he is the F A Howells of that 1901 and that's William and Mabel HI Steph Sorry to confuse you, you are right Florence never married she was a school teacher and prior to WW! I think teachers had to give up if they married. Ada Jane was the mother and she had previously been married to Arthur Howells of Abergavenny and I made a mistake she died 25th June 1931. Mabel is 1893 and William is 1886. I dont know if they continued to live in Wales I have just been spending hours and hours going through the Marriage and Death index. Many thanks to the both of you and if any other kind person can throw me an idea where to go next THANKS Pam XX

Have just phoned the wonderful bereavement services at Thornhil Cardiff and asked them and no luck they dont have them and they can search the records they have from approx 1912 to present day except for church grave yards. The lady there is so nice and so helpful she is always willing to look Pam

Hi Pam, I must stop coming on here late at night. You answered Chrissie that the F A Howells on the 1901 Census was the brother that died in India. If that is the case where is Florence? This brother that died in India, was he there on his own? What was his name? Anyway I'm now off to see what I can see, if anything. Steph

Sorry Steph, I didn't put all the 1901 info on because I assumed that Pam had already got it. I found the family in Wales and Florence was there too.

Hi Chrissie, I don't have the 1901 census but had just found the 1891 census and the brother was shown as C F A Howells aged 9. So presumably he was 19 on your census. Steph Just found a birth for Charles Frederick A Howells in Cardiff Mar Qtr 1882.

This is it:- Florence Howells Age in 1901: 16 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1885 Relation: Daughter Mother's Name: Ada J Gender: Female Where born: Merthyr Civil Parish: St Mary Ecclesiastical parish: St Dyfrig County/Island: Glamorgan Country: Wales Street address: View Image Condition as to marriage: View Image Education: View Image Employment status: View Image Occupation: View Image Registration district: Cardiff Sub-registration district: West Cardiff ED, institution, or vessel: 10 Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Name Age Corton 28 Ada Day 14 Ann Day 60 Ada J Howells 34 F A Howells 18 Florence Howells 16 Mabel Howells 7 William Howells 14 Annie Japp 40 Manners 35 Alice Pegg 42 Alice Shelden 20 View original image View blank form Save This Record Attach this record to a person in your tree as a source record, or save for later evaluation. Save Source Citation: Class: RG13; Piece: 4985; Folio: 155; Page: 75. The father seems to be away but Ada says married.

Pam, Have you got the death certificate for Florence? Who was the informant? Steph

Pam, Have found this death in Jun Qtr 1941 William A Howells aged 54 District Bedwelty Vol 11a Page 575 It's in Wales and the age is right. Steph

My eyes are giving up. I gt very excited when I found the death of a Mabel Howells in Sept 1976 with a dob 1893. Unfortunately it was December!! Oh well I'll look in again tomorrow. Steph

I'm confused Steph. Do we know what month Mabel was born then? Mind you, I've had a look for Mabel born December (probably be in the Jan quarter) and there isn't one in Dec and the only one in Jan is Mabel Evelyn Howells born in Cardiff. So wrong middle name.

Thanks so much for all you have done to help me find the family and sorry I have not got back to you both as I have been away for a few days. I have Mabel's birth as 1/4 1893 Cardiff 11a 284, I also have Florence's death certificate which was registered by her friend Gwendoline Irene Robinson the notice in the South Wales Echo says On May 14th(1975) Flossie of 169 Newport Rd (Cardiff) beloved sister of Mab's and the late Billy dear friend of Rene Robinson Resting at Roath Court Funeral Home until the service in the chapel at noon afterwards at Cathays Cemetery. The one for her mother said On June 25th at her residence Ada dearly loved mother of Flossie, Mabel and Billy Howells. Funeral private 2.15 Wednesday next. Through this I know Billy is alive at that time but died before Florence, I have sent for a certificate of the one William A Howells you so kindly found and also one for Rene Robinson as she was still living at 169 Newport Rd after Florence's death so maybe that will give me a lead. Thanks for all your help, will let you know what they show Thanks Pam XX

Hi Pam I have just been trying to solve this Mabel puzzle. You say that she was born 1/4/1893 but there is no Mabel Registered for that quarter. There is a Mabel Jane Registered Jan-March quarter in Cardiff and the ref is the same as the one you quoted - 11a 284. Did your Mabel have a second name? There is also a Mabel Evelyn Howells death - again Jan-March in Cardiff 11a 306 The only other one in 1893 is in the Oct- Dec quarter but she has been listed as Mabel Howell (no S). I wonder if this one never married either and is the death that Steph found? Chrissie

Well, there's something wrong somewhere Pam. I have just checked for a death of Mabel from 1977 (after the dates that Steph had checked) right up to 2005 and I can't find her. So either:- 1 - We have missed her. 2 - She married. 3 - Her birth was a different date from what you thought. 4 - She has been mistranscribed 5 - She had a middle name 6 - She is still alive and is now 114 years old:) I did find some interesting facts along the way. For instance, in July-Sept 1913 a Mabel Howells married a Frederick Howells in Pontardawe. Cousins maybe? Chrissie Must go and get some ironing done:))

I think that the poster was saying that Mabel's birth was 1st qtr.........although it didn't look like that.......it looked like 1st April............ Reg

Thanks Reg. I wonder if she is the Mabel Jane then?

I've just had a thought Pam. Do you know for sure that Mabel was born in Jan-March 1893? Have you actually got the birth cert? Or could it possibly be the Death that Steph found who was born in Oct- Dec? Bear in mind that the one registered Oct-Dec could have been born in September and registered in the following quarter.

Hi Chrissie, Gosh I got so confused when I first read what you said. But know I understand and maybe the death I found was correct because like you I was thinking Mabel was born in April, so the one I found with the December birth date could be her. Is Pam going to send off for her certificate I wonder? Steph