General Chat

France does not advertise its national speed limits at all and on top most of them are reduced by 10kph when the weather is bad. The gendarmes decide when the weather is bad. Limits vary a lot depending on the class of road and type of vehicle.

Enforcement of speed limits is very lax for the most part with random "crack downs" which make people fume and bite a big dent in tourist budgets.

A few years ago many "route nationales" ( A roads ) were reclassified to "routes departementales" with a drop in speed limit from 130kph to 90 kph. The only warning was the change in the road number on direction signs ... This was done to encourage people to use the autoroutes which are very expensive - a journey from Paris to Bordeaux costs more in tolls than fuel!

There is some limited signing of local limits but by and large once you have entered a "commune" the 50kph applies until you leave ( red diagonal stripe ). There are no repeaters.

On some autoroutes ( turnpikes ) the toll system might calculate yr speed since the last point and auto generate a speeding ticket.

In England there is no on-the-spot fine system for speeding so most tourists ( inc EU ) get away with it scot free. France otoh applies on the spot penalties. They take all major cards and cash ... no pay, no drive.

France has been slow to roll out ANPR type speed traps not the least because the French, like the Americans, are armed to the teeth and the cameras are a popular target. Typical weapons are 9mm automatic, pump action shotgun so it is best to take them seriously. Burglary rates are low ( why? ) though it is an offence to kill and maim burglars.

In rural areas driving licence suspensions often allow for the journey to work as there is hardly any frequent public transport outside of large towns. Suspensions for drink drive rarely exceed 90 days.

France does not have any kind of speed or driver awareness projects. OTOH drivers who are unaware soon have the fact marked by the many sad roadside memorials - the state has now resorted to black metal shades or silhouettes.

French road fatalities p.a. are well over twice that of the UK.
:-(

Rollo, I am sure I have seen speed limits shown on French motorways, although not on other roads.

We go to France in a motorhome and sometimes pop over the boarders to Spain or Switzerland. Before we go, we make sure we read up on the motoring law for where we are going (both of us even though I don't drive) and have a mph/kph converter on the speedometer. We don't assume that other countries have the same rules as the UK.

Take a look at this article, you may find it interesting:

http://goo.gl/ce5GhT

Thank you Jonesey for the article.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YSr1ZT0PkE

I myself am dubious about these awareness courses. Poor driving behaviour is rooted in the pyschology of the driver ( something which the D.M. piece makes obvious ) and no one day course will change that.

OTOH treating speeding as seriously as drink driving would produce a step change. Drunk drivers are not sent on on drink awareness courses.

Although total road fatalities in the UK have declined slowly this has been mainly due to better car construction, air bags and so on i.e. accidents for vehicle occupants are more survivable.

Unfortunately the trend for pedestrians and cyclist is quite the contrary and for these people the UK has the worst record in Europe.

That is one very good reason for observing urban and rural speed limits - the difference between being hit at 35pm rather than 30mph is life defining for a pedestrian or cyclist.

The poor road safety for non vehicle occupants has resulted in the current generations of children haveing the least personal freedom in hundreds of years. There are any number of downsides to this.

More than half of those holding a current driving licence in urban areas of England & Wales do not have endorsements. So either (a) they are extremely lucky at avoiding speeding controls year in year out or (b) they observe the speed limits. I repeat "just a few miles" over the limit is not trivial and it is not inevitable and no everybody does not do it. THINK it could be your rellie wandering out into the road, not paying attention, iPhones full blast ...

France does not advertise national speed limits on motorways. It does ( as in the UK ) put up signs where there is a lower limit for one reason or another. Under French law motorists are automatically liable for injury to cyclists & pedestrians under the "no fault" rules.

To say that it is difficult to observe the speed limit just because the car "does not like to go so slowly" is fatuous and suggests the driver does not really know how to drive. Much the same can be said of "it was a broad wide road" and other common excuses.

Ask any highways engineer, ambulance man or traffic cop what they think.

Interesting article in the Mail on line by somebody who has just attended one of these courses. One thing he put

Yesterday, as my wife entered a 40mph zone in Norfolk, I suggested she should drive in either second or third gear so that the noise of the engine would remind her of the limit — a tip John had passed on.

And, then, when she was preparing to turn right off a single lane across traffic I said she should not turn the wheels until she knew it was safe to make the manoeuvre. As John had pointed out, ‘if you do and someone shunts you from behind then you’ll end up being pushed into the oncoming traffic’.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2491840/The-short-sharp-shock-life-long-speeder-finally-slam-brakes-How-speed-awareness-course-changed-MARK-PALMERS-mind-putting-foot-down.html#ixzz2k3PrwAoK

AnninGlos, Thats the same article that Jonesey posted the link for 8 Nov 2013 08:00

Roy

"2nd or third gear at 40Mph?
does she tow a fuel bowser?

these days my mind is more on the fuel consumption than the speedo,

one complements the other.........I try to accelerate more smoothly, and brake a lot less.
on the overrun you are not using fuel, and am more aware of traffic and its distances and congestion.............I very rarely come to a complete stop at traffic signals or in traffic queues, I regulate my speed so that I DONT have to stop......
Bob

Good point Bob, To be honest my car will handle 40mph fine in 6th gear but i do have to drop 2 gears in to 4th if i need to accelerate passed a slow moving vehicle when i come out of the built up area,

Some drivers like to stay at 40mph when they have left the 40mph and enter roads with the national speed limit of 60mph and so Yes i do do overtaking

Roy

Mine won't use 6th under about 50mph. In 30 limits have to use 4th. Does mean that if I can accerlate out of a restricted zone, I can get to NSL very quickly.

Andy

http://www.pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyId=28415

Some interesting points about the use of gears. I only have 5 forward gears and always try to use the fifth gear asap. I use the gears to control speed as opposed to braking some time, but recently two of my friends of similar age, admitted that neither use the fifth gear in their car, adding that they don't go fast enough. I guess we all approach driving in a different way.

Drove smoothly save money on insurance with free app
http://www.aviva.co.uk/drive/

It is a whole lot cheaper to replace disk pads than to replace a new clutch.

Preferring the gearbox to slow the car instead of brakes is an idea which has its roots in the days of drum brakes and lots of fade. Back in the 60s for most cars - even the mini - putting in a new clutch plate was no big deal. It is now.

Automatics have improved out of sight and offer plenty of driver control even on performance cars. The UK addiction to 4/5/6 on the floor is I suppose the proof of habit over logic.

The use of gears to control your speed is NOT the same as using them to slow the vehicle down

As far as i'm aware no driving instructor would ever advocate using the gears to slow the car down, "even back in the 70's" Thats what your brakes are for

Roy

I don't think you quite grasp the engineering behind gear trains. Here is a very basic description which will be familiar to anybody who has ever done 'O' level physics.

Gear trains

Gear teeth are designed so that the number of teeth on a gear is proportional to the radius of its pitch circle, and so that the pitch circles of meshing gears roll on each other without slipping. The speed ratio for a pair of meshing gears can be computed from ratio of the radii of the pitch circles and the ratio of the number of teeth on each gear, its gear ratio.
Two meshing gears transmit rotational motion.

The velocity v of the point of contact on the pitch circles is the same on both gears, and is given by

v = r_A \omega_A = r_B \omega_B,\!

where input gear A has radius rA and meshes with output gear B of radius rB, therefore,

\frac{\omega_A}{\omega_B} = \frac{r_B}{r_A} = \frac{N_B}{N_A}.

where NA is the number of teeth on the input gear and NB is the number of teeth on the output gear.

The mechanical advantage of a pair of meshing gears for which the input gear has NA teeth and the output gear has NB teeth is given by

MA = \frac{T_B}{T_A} = \frac{N_B}{N_A}.

This shows that if the output gear GB has more teeth than the input gear GA, then the gear train amplifies the input torque. And, if the output gear has fewer teeth than the input gear, then the gear train reduces the input torque.

If the output gear of a gear train rotates more slowly than the input gear, then the gear train is called a speed reducer. In this case, because the output gear must have more teeth than the input gear, the speed reducer will amplify the input torque.

:-)

Rollo, I do hope your post "grasp the engineering" is not aimed at me?

I started my working life a motor machanic city and guild qualified back in the day when C&G took a 5 years apprenticeship that actualy meant something

Roy

True Rollo,(I guess)
but I am not in the habit(these days anyway) of making racing changes.

Janet, I find it hard to believe that , that they never use 5th because they don't go fast enough? but as you say we all drive differently

I am not really a slow driver, I enter faster roads using the slip road to be up to speed with the traffic I am joining, I achieve the speed limit as soon as practical and then back off.....my days of 124 miles in 93 minutes are long gone

It would be nice if speed limits actually reflected the speed capacity of roads.
I believe that the design speed of motorways is 100mph so with a 70mph limit jourey times are longer than they need be.
Before the 70mph limit I was travelling perfectly safely where appropriate at 100mph and have done over a million miles in cars and on motorbikes without any convictions or serious accidents (those i had were mainly on a motorbike due to car drivers "not seeing me" despite my wearing high visibility clothing).
A major factor in accidents is that road capacity has not kept pace with population incrtease.
And in town the boy racers ignore any speed limits except going past a camera, anyway.

if only my husband was still here - he was an engineer and gears and clutches was his field - Renold Power Transmission

I see the chap in the newspaper report says the same as I did, that new drivers should go on a speed awareness course before they get caught for speeding, it would educate them and make them more aware of the reason for speed limits etc.

It took me a while to get the hang of using the fifth gear as I had only had older cars before that had just 4 gears. It is supposed to save petrol when used on journeys where you travel faster for some distance.

Anyway folks, safe driving and watch those hands!

Lizxx

The design speed of motorways is 70mph and this is not likely to change. A higher design speed would require a different layout for exit ramps, junctions, site lines and so on and so forth. The cost wuld be prohibitive. Highway engineers, the police and insurance companies are dead against such an increase. A small number of Tory MPs are in favour.

Drivers were not designed for 70 mph let alone a higher speed.

Increasing the speed differential between traffic entering the motorway and traffic on the motorway is also dangerous. Same thing for increasing speed differntial between HGVs and passenger cars.

Far from increases to > 70mph much more likely are variable speed limits as has become the norm on parts of the M25 for instance.