Genealogy Chat

From time to time we all send off for the wrong certificate. Here are some usefull tips for beginners. Please feel free to add your tips and I apologise if the tips have been on here before. 1) Send for certificates in a logical sequence - 1 at a time is my moto. A childs birth cert. usually comes before the parent's marriage cert., because it gives the mothers maiden name. 2) Unless you have oodles of cash only send for the certs that you really need. 3) If you have a great grandfather John Smith who had a brother Zacharriah then send for the brother's cert. it will give pretty much the same information and there is much more chance of getting the right one. 4) Look at witnesses to marriages and informants at deaths, if you do not recognise the names check them out on the nearest census. They may have been just friends or if you are lucky, one of your relatives.

Lorraine What they meant was the info you gave WASN'T what was on the cert. If you say father is James Jones and his name on the cert is Jim or Jas, you may not get it. I have found that less is often more, if you know what I mean. Two useful sites: a list of registration districts, showing which parishes/towns are included and dates and volume numbers: www.fhsc.org.uk/genuki/REG/index.htm and a list of current local register office contacts: www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/RegOffice/ Two more bits of advice 1) some local register offices, especially in London, do not provide certs for genealogical purposes 2) if you order from the GRO you will get a photocopy of a copy of the cert, done when the entry was new - ie an 1846 cert will be an 1846 copy. If you order locally, you may find an uptodate copy - ie if you order an 1846 cert in 2005, someone in 2005 may copy it out. This may not matter to you, but I prefer the original copy of the cert where poss. It has more 'flavour' and doesn't have someone else's interpretation of the handwriting. nell

hi there David's tips are the best way to go, always look for non familiar names first, ie Job and not John, theres hundreds of Johns and much few Jobs. BUT and heres a problem which can only be solved by buying one at a time. 3 thomas lee's ALL born in the same year, in the same place MANCHESTER and none of them related. One was my wife Grandfather. 3 thomas lee's all died in the same year as her Granddad, all the same age at death, all in the same place, LPOOL. the year was known and the approximate date, but how could I possibly know which one to pick? so I spent a couple of pounds extra an asked GRO to supply only the cert with the wifes name as ELIZ FANNY LEE. so instead of spending £21 I spent £14 in getting the right one first time. If you order from REGISTER OFFICES direct as per the GRO Ref, they will almost certainly look up for you and only provide the cert with the info you requested, they are usually all very good and helping you, with one or two exceptions, and they usually dont charge you any extra for the cert. TED

well I am not a newbie but you have given some excellent advice I did not think to order the brother with the rarer names birth cert what a good idea as I have often got the wrong cert, if its a common name , hope you dont mind me jumping your thread

Getting a siblings cert is a good place to start for instance I had Polly Foster so I didn't know if she was Mary or Polly. However her mother used the name she was brought up with on the siblings cert but put her correct maiden name on Polly's cert. Also don't forget siblings can have different mother's with the same first name. I have one gentleman who married three different ladies called Mary - do you think he had a memory problem? Try and start with what you know and work backwards step by step and remember that although it would be easier and 'fits' it may not be right. Due to a trascription error in the 1881 census and 2 people of the same name being born in the same village in the same year I ended up following the wrong family however if I had checked all the info on the certs that I did have it would have saved me a lot of time and effort. Pippa

Using the names of other siblings with less common names is often useful when searching census returns too. Don't forget to do as much as possible for free before you spend your hard earned brass as we say up here.

Don't do as i did. Looked for great g/father for weeks found him so excited sent for cert, wrong parents names. double checked and further down the image page was the right one, i just assumed the first one was him as everything seemed to match, i ended up going over all the birth pages again and some extra ones so lots of time wasted ....MOE!

This is definitely good advice. I can't really call myself a newbie or novice anymore but I do get a bit over-excited if I think I've found mine. Over the last week I've ordered two lots of certs. First batch of 3. 4 days later a batch of 8. Because I was careless, the batch of 8 included 2 I had already ordered in the batch of 3. That could be either £14 wasted or £28 if they're the wrong ones. SO, definitely good advice David. Best wishes Jan xx

To set the record straight as it were. I stand correcting on this but as I understand it local records were/are copied and sent to a centralised office in London - the GRO National Archives. If you request a certificate from the nationalarchives(.)gov.uk they use a template with a hole in it and photocopy the copy. You then get a certificate with the current date of issue and the old copied information. If you request a certificate from the Local registry office you get a photocopy of the original, again using a cut out template to give the current date of issue and issue number. Hope this helps

A couple of points to add: David and Nell - yes, the GRO will usually give you a photocopy of their copy (well, actually I believe they do it by computer now) but if it doesn't come out very well they may copy it out by hand or type it out instead. Also a local register office can often provide a photocopy of the original, but sometimes can't. I have a feeling that the original obtained in this way of a marriage cert would only contain the people's actual signatures if they married at the register office? Otherwise you would be better looking at the parish register entry if you wanted to see the signatures? (But in the only case where I really wanted to see the actual signature they had married at the register office, and the local register office sent me a copy.) Secondly, bear in mind if you order a birth certificate of a sibling instead of your ancestor that he or she could have a different mother from your ancestor, unless you are certain their mother was the same, i.e. you have the family on censuses before and after the birth of the sibling and the wife is the same on both and your ancestor was also born between the two censuses. Or something like that. What I mean is don't make the mistake of getting a younger sibling's birth certificate and assuming the mother was also the mother of your ancestor when she was really his or her stepmother. But certainly it can be a good idea. Kate.

The only thing I can add is - Check, check and check again, never assume and don't be in too much of a hurry to order any Certificate. I badly wanted a birth cert for a Mary Lowther but as it happened I was strapped for cash and she had to go on hold, as it happens she was the wrong Mary..mine had been registered under her fathers middle name! (Confusing lot my Lowthers but that's another story) With some there will always be an element of doupt and you may have to take a chance. Oh and when you have a small colection make a note somewhere of the ones you already have - I've ordered the same Marriage cert twice by mistake too.

Another tip! Ask all your relatives if they have any of the old certificates. I never imagined any of mine would so was quite disgruntled when I told my cousin I'd ordered my g grandfathers marriage cert only for her to tell me she already had it! Debby

nudge

Has anyone mentioned that ordering on line you can do a reference check. My husband is still trying to find the birth of a Wiliam Williams, Oscroft Tarvin. From the census he knew the parents were Thomas and Martha so cross checked on 4 certs. I think they remove £3 for this . Still can't find him but through the brother Samuel, has mothers maiden name.

I keep a record card at the front of each line in my folders, with a note of the name, type of cert and GRO ref. Then when I have a bit of spare cash I can flick through them, pick out the most 'useful' ones, cross them out and order them. Every few months I go through them and see if I'm missing any refs or if there's anything that I really ought to order. Seems to work for me. Regards Trudy

Hi Again, Rose you can request a better copy if the writing is poor. Take a photo-copy and send back the original. Another tip I had an ancestor born 1837 and couldn't find a reference so I assumed that he was born before the start of the BMD referencing. Very annoying, but again I was able to send for a later sibling's Birth Certificate and so find the mothers maiden name.

Just had a stroke of luck. I recieved a marriage cert and the witnesses were Joe and Ann Elizabeth Mallinson. No one in my tree by that surname but from my early childhood I remembered an 'aunt' Ann'Lizabeth but had no idea of her married name so now I was able to look up Joe Mallinson on free BMD and there he was marrying my great aunt Ann E Ellis Also I've just sent off for a birth cert 1839 the sister of my ggggrandfather who was born 1836 it might just solve a mystery of the unknown lady who was a boarder on one census, mother-in-law on another census and a mother on the next. Good hunting, Dave

I have received both photocopies of originals AND freshly typed or handwritten modern copies from the GRO. Similarly, I have also received photocopies of the originals when ordering directly from the relevant Register Office. I guess it depends on the day and who's finding your cert for you!

Another little tip is check IGI. I have purchased several copies of wedding certificates only to find the details later on IGI. I could have used that £7 to buy another copy of a certificate to help my research. Good Luck Irene

Ha! Ha! i have just read my piece on your first page, and guess what! the RIGHT one arrived last week and again it was the WRONG one, so don't be like me and give advice without knowing what you are doing!!!LOL> MOE!