Genealogy Chat

Does anyone know when cremations first started in the uk please. And would you be able to find lists of people cremated the same as you can burials at the local records office's. My grandad commited suicide in 1936 and i am tryig to find where he was laid to rest. Kal

From Google:- The first cremation On 26th March 1885 the first official cremation at Woking took place. Mrs. Pickersgill, a well-known figure in literary and scientific circles, was the first of three cremations that year. Mr. Charles William Carpenter was cremated on 19th October and in December the third cremation. In 1886 there were ten cremations and during the year 1888, there were a total of 28. Kath. x

If you have his death certificate, I would get in touch with the council offices for the place where he died and ask for the cemeteries department. They should be able to tell you whether he was buried or cremated at one of their cemeteries. Kath. x

hiya, have you got his death cert? this would help, as it would give an area, from there you will have to ring all local cemeteries/crematoria and find out that way, i dont belive there is an index as such to tell you this, i dont know whether it was still an offence then to commit suicide, but a burial seems very unlikely, as the church frowned up it HTH Julie

Thanks kathleen, I was hoping it started later then that. is it possibly true then that if a person commited suicide he wouldn't be buried in consecrated ground, is this myth ? or not. I am trying so hard to find out where my grandad would be.

I have his death cert which was in Birmingham, i also have his inquest papers, which even though it gave me clues to family members it did not tell me where he would be buried/cremated. Not long ago i had a photograph given to me of my aunts and uncles when they were very young, stood next to a lot of flowers in a grave yard but its impossible to tell if its a grave or not. I have already tried five of the local burial grounds in Birmingham. I have never heard of cremation lists if they would exist. Kal

I think there were some vicars who wouldn't bury a suicide in consecrated ground, but I don't think it was all of them. Do you have the death certificate? Kath. x

Yes kath i do but it doesnt help. Kal

At our local cemetery they have all burials and cremations on computer, and you just have to give them a name and they will tell you of anyone of that name who was buried or cremated at any of their cemeteries (either the recent cemeteries or the older ones that are not used any more). I'd be surprised if the ones in Birmingham don't have something similar. Have you tried the County Record Office? He died in Birmingham. Do you know if that is where he usually lived, or had he just gone there before comitting suicide? Kath. x

Kath, I have started searching all the microfilms for churches around the Birmingham area, but keep coming up with nothing. Trouble is there are so many in Brum. Kal

Yes kath he did live in brum when he committed suicide, i have a piece from the newspaper (but couldn't find an obituary). as well as his inquest papers, I was lucky to get his inquest papers because of the 75 year privacy clause, the coroner let me have them earlier then ithey should have been released, makes very sad reading and really made me cry, i so want to find where he has been laid to rest, tried 5 burial grounds in the area where he lived, and nothing.

Have you checked to see if anyone else on this site has your grandfather in their tree? (using the quick search box at the top of the page). The other thing you could try is to put a letter in a local paper in Birmingham, asking if anyone remembers your grandfather, and that you are looking for his last resting place. It's a long shot, but anything is worth it if you get an answer. I looked for my grandfather's death for three years (he'd left the family and never came back). By chance I found a second marriage for him when he was 60, and from that certificate, a librarian managed to find him on electoral rolls, found obituaries for him and a daughter's name and old address. From that I put a letter in the local paper for the area, and I'm now in contact with this lady (my father's half sister who he knew nothing about, although unfortunately he died many years ago without knowing any of this). I do now know though, where my grandfather's ashes were scattered. Anything is worth a try. Kath. x

Hi Kath, unfortunately he's not on here, sob. I did find a sister for him not long ago, living in the same area, what shocked me was she died only a few years ago not far from me, all this time there was someone alive that would have known and i knew nothing about her, But i wont give up the search. Kal

All cremations are recorded - should be with the relevant crematorium. He might not have been buried or cremated where you expect though. My grandfather died in North London but was moved to Norfolk to be buried with his wife.

It will take time but you need to find out which crematoriums were open at the time of his death. If he was cremated then they should have details even if his ashes were taken elsewhere. If he was buried it would be worth trying public cemetaries and not church. It has been known for people to even find unmarked graves dating back 200 years. As for suicides it is mainly the Catholic church which refused to bury them on consecrated ground. If he was C.o.E there must be a record somehwere. Wishing you all the best in your search Wendy

hi hun i know this probably wont help but i'll tell you anyway lol dad and i went to the local cemetary and visited my rellies graves .dad knew exactly where they were laid to rest. we took pics and then i went to the office for info but it was shut. when i got home i phoned the local council and they said they would send me the info a few days later they phoned me and told me that there were no such people buried in wycombe cemetary!!! i told them that i knew they were as i had visited the graves and got photo's of the headstones. they were quite adamant that they were right and i was wrong. they told me that they didnt have the records. i think that they just couldnt be bothered to look. susie

I too think he is likely to be buried in a cemetery, rather than a churchyard. When I've viewed burial records for a cemetery, I've noticed a column indicating whether or not the ground was consecrated. This varied on individual records within the same cemetery. As you know where he was living, I'd start at the cemeteries nearest there, that was open for burials at that time. Gwyn

Suicide was illegal until 1961. Since 1880 there are no restrictions on consecrated ground. If the vicar has reasons for not wanting to do the honours, you can have the burial without the vicar, certainly in a cemetary (would seem odd in a churchyard) But the vicar will normally attend so long as the inquest verdict has the usual wording about 'while of unsound mind' or 'while the balance of his mind was disturbed'. Suicide isn't treated as a sin in that case. My ggm was buried in consecrated ground by the vicar after she jumped in the canal in 1916

Just a small point but do you know where he committed suicide as he may have been buried there rather than near his home. A relative of mine was buried in the village where he died as his widow couldn't afford to bring him home for burial.

Many many thanks for all the help and replies. Where he died was basically in the centre of Birmingham, so he could really be anywhere. I have another question.......... I got my grandads inquest papers from the Birmingham Coroner, and granted my grandad died in 1936, and i only got the copy of it a couple of years ago, but would it be possible that the coroner would know where he was buried/cremated do you think. Would it be possible the the coroner's office would know, shall i write again and ask them if they know where he was layed to rest. Kal xxxxxxxx