Genealogy Chat

In my Lyon family 1841 census it refers to to the family address as Rectory

when I looked up about that
It states
The rectory is the living in the

Please what does 'the Living in the' mean ?

The Rectory is where the vicar lives

The Living, is a term in canon law (ie, church law) ........ it means a position in a church (usually the Church of England) that has attached to it a source of income. The holder of the position receives its revenue for the performance of stipulated duties.


In olden days, The Living was often in the hands of local landed gentry rather than in the hands of the Church itself. So the local "lord" would be able to nominate whoever he liked to hold the position of the Vicar in that living.



so either your ancestors were the Vicar, a member of the vicar's fmaily, or servants at the Rectory



Rectory is also sometimes called a Parsonage.




sylvia

Thank Sylvia,
they were servants to the rectory then.
Wm occupation was blacksmith.

could a blacksmith also be a vicar? I doubt it.

Annette


so do I!



although sometimes one of the non-Anglican or Catholic religions would have had other jobs

eg., Methodist, or Wesleyan-Methodist, or Quaker ,........ but I don't think those religions necessarily lived in Rectories.


Do you want to give me the name so I can see if I can make more sense of it?




sylvia

Wm Lyon born 1791 died 1846

In the 1841 census Cranford Kettering district

WM
wife Eleanor
Ann
Francis
and a few others,
Im fairly sure that they were C of E as they were married In the church St Andrews Cranford
But I was mainly interested in the Address of Rectory.

Thanks

Hi

This one?

1841 Census

Name: Wm Lyon
Age: 45
Estimated birth year: abt 1796
Gender: Male
Where born: Northamptonshire, England

Civil Parish: St John Cranford
Hundred: Huxloe
County/Island: Northamptonshire
Country: England

Registration district: Kettering
Sub-registration district: Kettering

Wm Lyon 45 Blacksmith
Eleanor Lyon 45
Ann Lyon 20
Francis Lyon 20
Elizth Lyon 20
Allice Lyon 12
George Lyon 8
Charles Lyon 7
John Lyon 4
Caroline Lyon 2
N K Lyon 1 MO


I don't actually see Rectory written anywhere? I just see Cranford St Andrew written across the top of the page ...... meaning the parish where all the people were living.


Many English and Welsh villages in the 1841 Census (and even the 1851) did not actually have a street address ...... they were too small


Many of the 1841 censuses do not show street names for the smaller villages, and it may be that the streets were not named.



I'm not sure if you are aware that ages of people over the age of 15 were supposed to be rounded down to nearest 5 on the 1841? Not all enumerators did it, just to make life confusing for us! But this one did .............. William didn't really have triplets age 20!


All that means is that Ann, Francis and Elizabeth were between the ages of 20 and 24.



sylvia

yes I am aware of the age thing
Francis my GG grandfather was born 1820, and the 2 girls either side of him

Well I used the genes census
and clicked on view

but I saw from the image just as you have

Thanks alot Sylvia

FMP 1841
1841 census - household transcription
Person: LYON, Wm
Address: Rectory, Cranford St Andrew

.
LYON, Wm M 45 1796 Northamptonshire VIEW
LYON, Eleanor F 45 1796 Northamptonshire VIEW
LYON, Ann F 20 1821 Northamptonshire VIEW
LYON, Francis M 20 1821 Northamptonshire VIEW
LYON, Elizth F 20 1821 Northamptonshire VIEW
LYON, Allice F 12 1829 Northamptonshire VIEW
LYON, George M 8 1833 Northamptonshire VIEW
LYON, Charles M 7 1834 Northamptonshire VIEW
LYON, John M 4 1837 Northamptonshire VIEW
LYON, Caroline F 2 1839 Northamptonshire VIEW
-, - F 0 (1 weeks) 1841 Northamptonshire VIEW

Interesting

...... ancestry doesn't show Rectory at all!


sylvia

The ref for the Lyon h/h is:
Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece 803; Book: 8; Enumeration District: 8; Folio: 4; Page: 19;

There's no Rectory mentioned on the image - the last address mentioned is 3 pages earlier, and has 2 h/h's (Ancestry says they're cmbined into 1).


1841 England Census
Civil Parish: St John Cranford
Hundred: Huxloe
County/Island: Northamptonshire
Country: England
Street address: Rectory
Registration district: Kettering
Sub-registration district: Kettering

Margaret Wigles 24

Mary Davys 51
Henry Stapley 22 M.S.
Sarah Betts 50 F.S.
Eliza Hune 40 F.S.

Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece 803; Book: 8; Enumeration District: 8; Folio: 3; Page: 16;
[All pob's out of county]

So where am I going with this?

Does Rectory actually mean the home

or is it a district such as Rectory for example?

I think it could just be the street name

jax

Oh

I will go look to see if there is still a Rectory street in Cranford St Andrew.

I agree with jax


either that (the street name) or the district


certainly not THE Rectory with so many people living in it!!



sylvia

Hi Sylvia
What a wild storm we had and it lasted four hours. we had 37mm rain here and the farm had 50mm. I always turn my PC off when there is lightening around.

I looked on Maps,
There is no Rectory Street or Road.

However there is a Rectory Hill, and the road is somewhat circular.
the words 'Rectory Hill' is written along the road.

So that's why, its like a little suburb, near Dairy Farm Guest House.
Which seems to be part of the Cranford Hall Estate.

My guess is all these people were servants of the Lord of the Manor, a Mr Robinson.

Thanks for pointing me in the right direction.

Next time I will look at maps first,
Here I learn.

mgnv
Thanks for your help

How do I use your source citation to browse the pages you refer to.

that is
how do I get from one page to the next, to look at other families in Rectory Hill?

Hi

I don't always turn off the computer when we have lightening, although I know that I should!


we had very heavy rain today!

Have you found him on the 1851 Census?

I don't know whether a blacksmith would be considered a servant of the Lord of the Manor.



sylvia

If you are looking at the census's on Genes you can't go to the previous page only on FMP or ancestry that can be done

jax

No I dont have him in 1851

He was buried 19 February 1846 at Cranford St Andrew

Francis the son came to Brisbane Aust in 1850

But I do have Eleanor (born Nobottle) who at this census has the occupation of Victuallar and grocer (the word 'Blacksmith ' is crossed out
Wife Eleanor died 1869
cant find an address.

Just out of my own curiosity (!), here's the family in 1851

1851 Census

Name: Eleanor Lyon
Age: 56
Estimated birth year: abt 1795
Relation: Head
Gender: F (Female)
Where born: Nabottle, Northamptonshire, England

Civil Parish: Cranford St Andrew
County/Island: Northamptonshire
Country: England

Registration district: Kettering
Sub-registration district: Kettering

Eleanor Lyon 56 Widow, Victualler & Grocer
Alice Lyon 21 At Home
Charles Lyon 17 Blacksmith
John Lyon 14 At Home
Caroline Lyon 12 At Home
Sarah Lyon 7


no street address given

This was on p. 2 .... the only address given is on p. 1, against the first house there, and that was Rectory House

Then looking at the descripiton of the enumeration distrcit 3b, it says:-

The whole of the 2 parishes of Cranfords St John and Cranfords St Andrew - including Abbott's Lodge, Manor Farm Lodge, Five Willow Lodge, London Ends, Barracks Yards, and village of Crandfords St John; Rectory House, Cranfords Hall, Workers's (??sp) Lodge, Sir George Robinson's Lodge, Glebe Farm Lodge, Duck Ends, and the village of Cranfords St Andrew

No other house name appears against any of the apparently independent hosueholds until p. 6, when Dairy House is shown with one occupant (occupation Dairy Woman.


The very next named house is that of Sir George Robinson also on p. 6 ................... liivng at Cranford Hall, as Rector, Bart, Landed Proprietor farming 485 acres, employing 42 Agricultural labourers.





so I would assume that the village is actually so small that the "plebs" didn't get either street addresses, house names, or maybe even street names!!!




sylvia