Genealogy Chat

Thanks Quoi

Rev Gould was for many years minister (1849-1882) of St Mary's Baptist Church, Norwich. There was aa Baptist Church and an Independant chapel in Horton Lane. I have contacted the Regents Park College, Bristol, twho hold Baptist Union records.to see if they have aany information on Rev J Holiday. Independent chapels were often later called Congregatiional.

Rev J Holiday was also a Baptist Minister, and I think he would be earlier than that.

Thanks for the work and also for the pm, I will look at the site you mentioned.

David

1841 census Jonathon Glyde
Age: 33
Estimated birth year: abt 1808
Gender: Male
Where born: Yorkshire, England
Civil parish: Bradford
Hundred: Morley
County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England
Registration district: Bradford
Sub-registration district: Horton
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Jonathon Glyde 33 independent minister
Elizabeth Glyde 33
Lomington Glyde 15
Janes Kendall 25
Selina Brearley 15
John P Barnaby 4
living Horton Road

Bradford Observer 1839
Horton Lane Town Mission
The annual meeting of the Christian Instruction Society and Town Mission connected with Horton Lane Independent Church which societies are now incorporated was held in the chapel on Monday night
The attendance was larger than on former occasions.The Rev J GLYDE

could this be Rev G Gould ?

I have found a few references to a Rev Anthony Holliday
Brunswick Street Chaple
and also this
Yorkshire Herald Feb 4th 1899
HOLLIDAY GREENHOW
on Jan 31st at St.Cuthberts church East Rainton Rev John Holiday M.A. to Sarah daughter of the late John Greenhow North Hetton
no cards

There was a Baptist college in Horton at the time, perhaps J Holiday was a trainnee, or tutor?

Yes Horton Lane Bradford later called Little Horton Lane.

I checked a later directory and it gave a list of chapels, and residents were listed as Rev xxxx, Baptist, but didn't say which chapel they were associated with. There seemed to be many more ministers than chapels, there were 7, 4 Particular and 3 General Baptist chapels. There was no J Holiday, so he could have been before Betts or after him, of she could have remembered his name incorrectly.

David

is that the chapel in Bradford or ??



sylvia

I have found the chapel in some trade directories. It was called Trinity (The site kept crashing last time I tried it.)
Chapel. Ministers were:
1866 H J Betts.
1871 J Russell
1879/80 J Russell,

Sylvia,

Thank you.

I believe it was you that helped me greatly withe Elizabeth L Grimes two or three years ago, She married Ernest Palmer in 1889 had a son in 1890, Charles Kenneth Alexander Palmer and emigrated to Canada in 1902. Living at Huntsville Ont. Both Charles and Ernest joined the CEF, Charles coming to England then France. He was given compassionate discharge in 1919 due, I believe, to the illness of his father who was invalided out due to Pneumonia (probably flu) reattested for further treatment and then, probably died, The last I can find of the family was in 1920 When Charles married Marie Disirée Piret of Belgium. I have been sent a Belgian family tree with her family on it and also her Belgian birth cert. (On it her father is Pirez but signs Piret.)

I cannot find if they had any children, or if they visited England again. From family converstions, I beleive they may have done.

David

I'm sorry ....... I guess I was feeling a little tetchy when I first came on here, and took your message the wrong way.


But I honestly don't see how we can find out if Joseph was Rev J ................ I did try to find him on another census, but was not convinced that I had done so, and in any case the possible one also did not say he was a Baptist minister


so it would seem that trying to find Rev J Holiday is also a blind alley . unless you yourself have knowledge of a site listing Baptist ministers. I know of one that lists many ordained Methodists.


It could of course be Haliday/Halliday/Holliday!


I've just done a search for those spellings, and have found no-one listing himself as a Baptist minister or preacher.




sylvia

Sylvia, I am realyy upset that I have offended you, I had no intention of being ungrateful,

I useually look up the Ancestry census images, but my Ancestry ran out a week or so ago and I am looking for special offers to get back on.

The reason I am really interested to find some information as Baptist churches sometimes have records that are really usefule, for instance, My great grandmother was Elizabeth Louisa Grimes and was a member of St Mary's Baptist Church, Norwich. The receords give the following informatio about her.

Baptized and admitted to Membership, 26th Nov 1866. removed and transferred to Lowestoft Baptist Church (no date) then went to Hitchen {1881 census confirms this) returned to Norwich in 1880. (Presumably this was beacuse of the death of her mother who was also a member and according to the records died in 1880. She was readmitted to membership April 30th 1883, but removed 1Jan 19th 1885 resigned to join the Salvation Army.

What the records don't say is that on Christmas day 1874. she married my great grandfather, Henry A Plested in the same church, They had two sons Henry 1875 and Alfred 1878 and that Henry A died in 1878 leaving the two sons who in 1881 were in separate lodgings in Bull Close Road, Norwich, while Elizabeth was in Hitchin.

I do appeciate yout help
regatds

David

Has there been a misinterpretation of good intentions here? Sylvia has found and posted some good stuff, and as far as I can see David has read and considered it.

Sylvia, I don't think David was lecturing you, and he probably doesn't know how experienced you are, so perhaps thought he was helping you improve your knowledge.

I hope nobody gets upset here.

David

you are quite correct .......... but they did usually list on the census both the occupation and the fact that they were a minister.


At least, that has been my experience with both Baptist and other non-conformist religious types.

It wasn't illegal, so they had no reason to keep it quiet.


I'm not inexperienced at looking for people on censuses, or in dealing with non-conformist religious people. I really didn't need a lecture on the topic!


I refuse to give you that census entry because there is absolutely no evidence that Joseph Holiday was or could be the Rev J Holiday


I will not post anything that is not provable ............... I may mention what I have found, as I did Jospeh, but that is mainly as an alert to other helpers that this person has been found and probably is discountable.



If you don't like that, then don't ask for help!




sylvia

Sylvia,

You wrote:

"I did try to find J Holiday in Bradford ........... I could only find a Joseph, and he wasn't a Baptist Minister!"

Baptist ministers were some times full time farmers, blacksmiths, etc. I came across one in Norfolk who was a farmer and pastor of a baptist church for 50 years and never received a penny as stipend, He also travelled as a visiting preacher and speaker at conferences.

On another thread, LindaB has put a link to a site which has links to Free Australian newspapers on line.

A brilliant site. I searched for Plested which returned over 1,300 results, of the 10 on the first page several were about my "Miss Plested"

There is an long and interesting article about Miss Plested in The Queenslander Sat 25 Oct 1890 where she is quoted as saying "There are 930,626 widows in Inda, 78,906 were under 9 years of age.

I had read somewhere in the past that she considered herself to be a suffragette.

Sylvia

Baptists kept records of baptisms and membership. It is just finding out if the still exist and where. I have been given info, in the past, that Emma Plested and Elizabeth Louisa Grimes, Henry's future wife, weer both baptised at St mary's and admitted to membership in 1866, perhaps the were friends?

I have been told that St Mary's records are held at Norwich Records Office. I hope to go there in a week or two.

I wrote recently to Yorkshire Baptist Association regarding Bradford, but as yet have not received a reply.

In the weald of Kent there were quite a number of Strict Baptist churches, one kept records of births, one of marriages and another of Burials. The births also list the midwife, very often a man, rather strange for thgose days, I thought.

Thanks for all your help, at least I have now got the names and details of all the children, and other details.

As to Unthank Road. I have just been reading two booklets on Baptist History in Norwich and there was a Baptist Chapel in Unthank Road, but it was built on Leasehold land and when the lease ran out, the Norwich corporation wanted mare than they could afford in revised rent or to purchase so the chapel closed in 1941.

Rose


I did try to find J Holiday in Bradford ........... I could only find a Joseph, and he wasn't a Baptist Minister!




sylvia

In 1871 Martha was a Servant in the household of a Martha Hawkins. A Rachel Plunket was also a Servant

1871 Census

Name: Martha Plauterd
[Martha Plested]
Age: 16
Estimated birth year: abt 1855
Relation: Servant
Gender: Female
Where born: London, England
Civil parish: Heigham
Ecclesiastical parish: Holy Trinity
County/Island: Norfolk
Country: England
Registration district: Norwich
Sub-registration district: West Wymer

Martha Hawkins 74 b.ca 1797, Norwich, Unmarried, Fund Holder
Rachel Plunket 49 b.ca 1822, Norwich, Cook
Martha Plauterd 16 Housemaid

Address:- Unthanks (???) Row



Rachel was House Servant with Martha Hawkins in 1861

In 1881, Rachel was Head and Annuitant living at 21 Essex Street, Heigham .................... which implies that Martha Hawkins had died and left her "comfortably off". In 1891, Rachel was Living on her Own Means at 41 Essex Street in Heigham. She died in 1910.


I don't think there was any "family" that took Martha to Cambridge.


It looks like Rachel Plunket(t) may have been a relation of Martha's mother Elizabeth. That Rachel got her a job as a House Maid with Miss Martha Hawkins, and that Martha then moved onto another job in Cambridgeshire with the Maris couple .... possibly after Martha Hawkins death in 1876


Deaths Sep 1876 (>99%)

Hawkins Martha 80 Norwich 4b 112



Our ancestors did move around more than we have been led to believe.



In other words, I think you are searching for something that didn't happen.



Remember that Martha didn't even leave for Australia until 1884 .... so whatever was written in the records down there came at least 20 years after the events happened.





sylvia

Wonder who took her to Bradford? Might be worth tracking down the Reverends.

I found George Gould in 1861 and 1871.

Rose