Genealogy Chat

I would get that 1915 birth cert to be sure.

Hi Brummiejan

Hi Gwyn in Kent.

Sorry girls couldn't get back to you both. Thanks so much for trying to help sort it all out.

Holley Baker's parents were David & Betsey (formerly Clifton) they did marry in 1899 and her parents were Joseph and Mary Clifton.

The family Brummiejan found is indeed my family, complete with mother in law Mary Clifton.

John and Isabella are David's parents, you are both so good at this. You both should have been detectives!.

But I think even I'm losing the plot as I don't know where the Holley b 1889 links in as I don't have another Holley in the family.

the Holley I have was born in 1915 son of David and Betsey Baker. So these Baker's are not mine
Mary Baker 48
Hollie Baker 11
Victor Baker 9
Jessie Thompson 21
Edmund Thompson 20

I have followed my Baker' cousins and there is only the one Holley and I don't have a Victor.

It is a strange christian name and one I've not come across before especially for a male. As I mentioned previously I had thought it was a female, so this has been enlightening and I thank you both for pointing me in the right (male) direction.

Regards, Lou


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Hollie is shown as Son on the image..... Talk about confusing !

1891

Name: Hollice M Baker
Age: 1
Estimated birth year: abt 1890
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Joseph
Mother's Name: Mary
Gender: Female
Where born: Willenhall, Staffordshire, England

Civil parish: Willenhall
Ecclesiastical parish: St Stephen
Town: Willenhall
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England





Registration district: Wolverhampton
Sub-registration district: Willenhall
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Joseph Baker 40
Mary Baker 40
Jessie G Baker 4
Allie B Baker 9
Lizzie K Baker 8
Christemal P Baker 4
Norah M Baker 3
Hollice M Baker 1


Gwyn

Holley 1901 I would say. He and David unlikely to be brothers I would think, but maybe cousins??

1901 England Census

Name: Hollie Baker
Age: 11
Estimated birth year: abt 1890
Relation: Son
Mother's Name: Mary
Gender: Male
Where born: Willenhall, Staffordshire, England

Civil parish: Dudley
Ecclesiastical parish: St Edmund
County/Island: Worcestershire

Registration district: Dudley
Sub-registration district: Dudley

Mary Baker 48
Hollie Baker 11
Victor Baker 9
Jessie Thompson 21
Edmund Thompson 20

Image reads David A

1891
Name: David D Baker
Age: 17
Estimated birth year: abt 1874
Relation: Son
Father's Name: John
Mother's Name: Isabella M
Gender: Male
Where born: Tipton, Staffordshire, England

Civil parish: Wednesbury
Ecclesiastical parish: St Bartholomew
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England


Registration district: West Bromwich
Sub-registration district: Wednesbury
ED, institution, or vessel: 7
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
John Baker 42
Isabella M Baker 42
John E Baker 18
David D Baker 17
Walter Baker 14
Philip E Baker 6
Sydney J Baker 5
Mary Baker 2
Phoebe Baker 18


Still looking for Holley to link him in
I think he is likely to be Holley Mathias b. 1889

Gwyn

Off on a bit of a tangent, but while we are waiting to hear back (this is Birmingham effectively):

1891

Betsy A Clifton

Age: 14
Estimated birth year: abt 1877
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Joseph
Mother's Name: Mary A
Gender: Female
Where born: Boddieoth, Oxfordshire, England

Civil parish: Aston
Ecclesiastical parish: St Oswald
Town: Bordesley
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England

Registration district: Aston
Sub-registration district: Deritend

Joseph Clifton 44
Mary A Clifton 45
Betsy A Clifton 14
Joseph T Clifton 13
William E Clifton 11
Percy J Clifton 5

Well done Gwyn - I was looking later! Found them 1911. Not sure Holley belongs to them unless The other Holley is his uncle - maybe 2 pairs of siblings married!!

BAKER, David Arthur Head Married
12 years M 37 1874 Pork Butchers Engineer Staffordshire Tipton VIEW
BAKER, Betsy Ann Wife Married F 34 1877 Oxfordshire Bodicote VIEW
BAKER, Arthur Ernest Son M 11 1900 School Warwickshire Birmingham VIEW
BAKER, Elsie May Daughter F 6 1905 School Warwickshire Birmingham VIEW
CLIFTON, Mary Ann Mother In Law Widow F 67 1844 Oxfordshire Bodicote VIEW

Registration District:
Aston Sub District:
Deritend EnumerationDistrict:
40 Parish:
Aston

Address:
41 Imperial Road Bordesley Green County:
Warwickshire

Marriages Mar 1899

Baker David Arthur ..Aston 6d 332
Clifton Betsy Ann ..Aston 6d 332

Hence the confusion....!
Arthur is 1 in the 1901 census.

Gwyn

Serious doubts now! Do you know when Arthur was born so we can check Betsy's maiden name?
jan

Sorry brummiejan
I was just editing, because that was bothering me too.

Gwyn

This must be the Holley who married above, but are these two different families? Where did your info come from?

(Oddly, I used to live just down the road at 62 Holly Lane!!)

BAKER, Mary Widower Widow F 57 1854 Willenhall Staffordshire VIEW
BAKER, Lily Kebarah Daughter Single F 27 1884 Rivet Sorter Willenhall Staffordshire VIEW
BAKER, Holley Son Single M 21 1890 Nut Cutter Willenhall Staffordshire VIEW
BAKER, Victor Son Single M 19 1892 Cycle Pedal Maker Wombourn Worcestershire VIEW
THOMPSON, Milicent Grandchild F 9 1902 School Dudley Worcestershire VIEW

Registration District:
Kings Norton Sub District:
Smethwick EnumerationDistrict:
22 Parish:
Smethwick

Address:
25 Holly Lane Smethwick County:
Worcestershire

But they must be yours!!

Births Mar 1917 (>99%)
Baker Mary J Clifton Kings N. 6d 230
Births Dec 1919 (>99%)
Baker Joseph H Clifton Kings N 6d 212

So are David and Betsey not their parents?

Hang on a minute!

Marriages Mar 1914 (>99%)

BAKER Holley M Clifton Kings N. 6d 77
Clifton Emma J Baker Kings N. 6d 77

This must surely be parents of the Holley Baker I found - and nothing to do with your Holly surely??

Jan

Maybe another member of this extended family

Name: Holley M Baker
Death Registration Month/Year: 1965
Age at death (estimated): 76
Registration district: Birmingham
Inferred County: Warwickshire
Volume: 9c
Page: 331

EDIT
Maybe his marriage...?
Marriages Mar 1914

BAKER Holley M ..Clifton ..Kings N. 6d 77
Clifton Emma J ..Baker ..Kings N. 6d 77

Gwyn

Well, I must say, the name is very peculiar - I assumed it was a woman, hence the "oops"! But the birth name confirms a man - unles "she" was very ahead of her time!
I think the others might be trickier as their names are more common.
best of luck, let us know how you get on.
If you want me to have a quick look at the electoral register (will be after 1945 obviously) I'm off to Brum in a couple of weeeks, just let me kmow.

jan

Hi Jan,

Doh! so sorry. My mistake, thanks again for helping.

I just assumed that the name Holley was female. I didn't realise it could be a man's name. It looks as if I've been looking for the wrong Holley. So many thanks for pointing that out.

And thanks for finding the children of that marriage too, I can't thank you enough. I shall now look at getting the marriage cert to see if he is my relative. ooh sound's strange now thinking of Holley as male.

Thanks again,
Regards, Lou

Holley is a man! He married Lily Beresford.
The two names are matched together, one married the other, no mistake.
Jan

Hi Brummiejan,

Thanks for helping.

That's Holley's birth, but I'm confused.

Are you saying that a Holley M Baker married a Beresford? Or was it a mistake and it should have been Lilly Beresford who married a Baker?
As that would match the births you found for a Baker whose MMN was Beresford, in which case it won't be my family.

Hi Tania,

Thanks also go to you for helping me.

If Brummiejan has made a mistake then it looks as if the death you found could be mine, although I have to say her middle name is a curios one! No-one else in the family has the surname Major and it's never been used as a 2nd name before.

Thanks again to you both your time and help has been great.

Regards, Lou

Possible children of Holley - MMN Beresford:

Mary C Baker Jan Feb Mar 1940 Birmingham Warwickshire
Robert F Baker Oct Nov Dec 1942 Birmingham
Patricia S Baker Apr May Jun 1951 Birmingham Warwickshire

Name: Holley Major Baker
Birth Date: 16 Sep 1915
Death Registration Month/Year: 1983
Registration district: Birmingham
Inferred County: West Midlands
Volume: 32
Page: 0487