Genealogy Chat

Pamela, we are surely all sorry to hear of your uncles's death, but wish the new baby all the best.

Margaret

With reference to the comment "I've had a look at the original entry and my relatives name is at the bottom of the page, handwritten, saying 11a D39. "

This was added in 1939 for the quarter that the birth originally took place. Sometimes there is an original entry, which is amended, otherwise it is added to the bottom of the page.

In other cases, the birth was registered the next quarter so another, possibly unamended entry can be found there.

My grandson's mum's mother, aunts and uncles were all re-registered after their mum and dad married many years after the birth of the first. One uncle has four entries altogether because of corrections.

It can be very confusing, and no two examples are exactly the same. The best way is to make a note of all the possible references you can find and take it from there.

In theory, if you order a cert using any of the references only the very last one should be issued. However if there is an entry that has not been amended / cross referenced, it is possible you could get a separate cert for that one.

as I think someone said earlier. Elizabeth was born before her mother married and was registered in her name

Births Mar 1934 (>99%)
Taylor Elizabeth M Taylor Cardiff 11a 606

after her mother married a Tamplin in 1939 Elizabeth's birth was re-registered in his surname

Thanks Ann

Thats the one, don't know why it would have been re-registered but puzzle solved thanks.

PM

You say your relative is Elizabeth tamplin reg 1934 - presumably this one

Births Mar 1934 (>99%)
Tamplin Elizabeth M Taylor Cardiff 11a see D39 Scan available - click to view
Tamplin Elizabeth M Taylor Cardiff ? see D39 Scan available - click to view

looking at Dec qtr 1939 (not yet transcribed on freebmd) you find this

Births Mar 1934 (>99%)
Tamplin Elizabeth M Taylor Cardiff 11a 759

Hi everyone

Yes.Mary is right I just think it was a coincidence that they were re-registered on the same day.

Thanks for all your help and sorry if I wasted your time.

Having a strange day today, I heard my uncle died this morning and my niece in Canada gave birth to a baby, so I lost one and gained one all in about 2 hourse.

Regards to you all.

Pam

Hi Pam

Your Elizabeth Tamplin and the Gwendoline Cable entries are nothing at all to do with each other. They just so happen to have both been re-registered in the Dec quarter of 1939 and are sheer coincidence.

There are all sorts of reasons why her birth was registered late. Maybe they were out of the country? Maybe they simply forgot?

Mary

I am even more confused Pam - what has your relative Elizabeth M Tamplin got to do with Gwendoline Gray/Cable? Apart from the fact that she also has her entry amended later.

Were you just using Gwendoline as being a similar example.?

Hi Pamela,

I don't really understand how you managed to get the registration for Gwendoline Cable but your Elizabeth Tamplin is registered in both the names of Taylor and Tamplin in 1934 then in Tamplin in 1939.

There is also a Taylor/Tamplin marriage in 1939.

Christine

Sorry for the delay but only just turned on computer. My family member was bon in March Quarter 1934 named Elizabeth Tamplin. The entry next to name says see 11a D39. When I searched on this number it gave me another birth of Gwendoline Cable mother Gray. I've had a look at the original entry and my relatives name is at the botton of the page, handwritten, saying 11a D39. I'm really confused. They are both registered in Cardiff. I think perhaps both births were registered on the same day and my Elizabeth was either left off and later corrected or she was a late entry. I think I may be seeing things clearer now, at first I thought perhaps a change of name or re-registration.

Thank everyone for your help.

Regards

Pam

My guess is the intial rego was for Gray in 1926q2, but it was outside the usual 6 week limit. Sometime in the next 13 y, the mother married Mr Gray, the father. They then rerego'ed the birth 1939q4 as Cable. This would cause a notation "see D 39" to be added to the initial rego, and a fresh 1926q2 entry in the name Cable to be added.
Now to cover the possibility of Gwen asking for her Jan 1st 1926 (say) b.cert, and there not being an entry in that quarter, an extra entry in the name Cable is created for 1926q1, referring to the 1939q4 entry.

I saw a similar thing happen before (but I never sent for the b.cert) - the child was baptized on his first b.day (also the parents' wedding day), and the parish register noted that fact, and the GRO index registration was 2 quarters out from the d.o.b.

Gwendoline and he husband are listed on the 2010 electoral roll.


Parents?

England & Wales, Marriage Index: 1916-2005
about Gwendoline L M Gray
Name: Gwendoline L M Gray
Spouse Surname: Cable
Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1927
Registration district: Southampton
Registration county (inferred): Hampshire
Volume Number: 2c
Page Number: 184
Spouse: Charles G Cable

Births Sep 1898
Gray Gwendoline Lilian M Pontypool 11a 175

England & Wales, Death Index: 1916-2005
about Gwendoline Lillian M Cable
Name: Gwendoline Lillian M Cable
Birth Date: 9 Jun 1898
Death Registration Month/Year: 1974
Registration district: Southampton
Inferred County: Hampshire
Volume: 20
Page: 1195



Rose

Ah but Mary the 1926 registration as Gray is typed in - so implies to me it was the original registration, and the notes at the foot of March and June 1926 were added later when the birth was re-registered in 1939.

Now whether that reregistration was due to a mistake on the original, or due to the mother marrying the father, I don't know.

I assume that's an extra-smiley face - otherwise how did you know I had two double chins? :-)

Pam, it might help if you tell us a bit more about this family - other children or anything. You might have to be a bit careful if they are living people.

You say you can't find "another" marriage for her - so which marriage is it that you have found? There are quite a few between Cables and Grays, though I haven't yet found one in Cardiff.

EDIT - I've still not found any record of a birth in 1932 as you said.

Ah, now my theory is different to yours Madmeg :-)))

I'd guess that the mother wasn't married at the 1st registration but didn't let on, hence Cable mmn Gray.

Then registered the birth correctly in Q2 as Cable AND Gray.

Had married Mr Cable by 1939 so re-registered the birth again as Cable mmn Gray.


Mary

Oh Mary is right, it is also registered as Gray in Jun 1926.

So, a different possibility is that it was registered in the wrong name (Gray) and should have been Cable and this wasn't spotted until 1939.

Or that the parents were unmarried in 1926 but married by 1939, and again the clerk has messed up the entries.

I can see the Mar 1926 entry - it says (twice) see D 39. I can see the too on FMP and Ancestry but not on Freebmd. Same name and same mother's name.

But somebody has screwed things up because the birth also appears in Jun 1926, with the same message (twice) to see D 39.

I can't see anything in Mar 1932 that could be her.

One guess might be that for some reason she was never registered in 1926 (or the documentation got lost at the register office) and was registered in 1939, but an entry put on the original year as well, by hand. Unfortunately by then the mother couldn't remember what quarter she had originally registered it in, as the child was perhaps born towards the end of March 1926 - so it got put on both quarters. The clerk obviously dithered about how to do it - wrote it at the bottom of the March quarter, then changed his mind and wrote it on the June quarter, then decided it should go on both of them.

Hi

If we're looking at the same birth, then it has been registered 4 times.

Q1 1926 as Cable mmn Gray
Q2 1926 as both Cable AND Gray
Q4 1939 as Cable mmn Gray

Mary

Hello Rose

I can't find the birth registration in 1939 for Gwendolin Cable. Can you tell me where you found it. I have a birth for March quarter 1926 with a note saying see another number.

Regards

Pam

The birth was reregistered in December 1939.

Rose

Thanks Wendy