Genealogy Chat

Any help would be great please.
On 1861 census my family - emery - were shown as having
john aged 44
ann aged 38
john aged 19
sarah aged 17
thomas and william (twins) aged 13
ruth aged 10
enoch aged 8
and henry aged 4
living in liverpool
but after numerous searches i cannot find anything that links them together (those that were born then) in 1851.
can't even find john and ann.
any ideas please?
many thanks
Louise

Ruth was actually born in 1852 so she won't be on the census. The twins were born 1847 so should have been 4.

Rose

thanks rose but i have looked up the names with ages around theirs as i know that their book keeping what not quite up to scratch, but still nothing.
there doesn't seem t be any twins on the census again looking at ages around and about.
can you tell me how you found out about ruth please?
thanks again
Louise

One of theses is Ruth's birth


Births Mar 1852 (>99%)

Emery Ruth Liverpool 8b 19
EMERY Ruth Liverpool 8b 89


The reason there 2 for Ruth is cos the image is unreadable and not sure if the last numbe is 19 or 89

But to me it looks like 19

It seems that Thomas & William aren't Twin they were born about 9 months apart

Births Sep 1846 (>99%)
Emery William Liverpool 20 528

Births Jun 1847 (>99%)
Emery Thomas Liverpool 20 511

wow julie thanks - how do you get this information? is it because you have access to loads of records yourself because I can't seem to get anywhere much on here for both names.
however at the side of thomas and williams names on the 1861 census they are linked and it looks very like the word 'twins'. this does not appear to have been added at a later date but at the time of the records.
any ideas?
thanks again
louise

1871 census Think this is your family
Name: Sarah Farrier
[Sarah Emery]
Age: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1846
Relation: Daughter
Spouse's Name: William
Father's Name: John
Gender: Female
Where born: Liverpool
Civil Parish: Kirkdale
Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street address:
Occupation:
Condition as to marriage:
Disability: View Image
Registration district: West Derby
Sub registration district: Toxteth Park
ED, institution, or vessel: 108
Household schedule number: 297
Household Members: Name Age
Enoch Emery 17
Henry Emery 13
John Emery 50
Thomas Emery 22
William Emery 22
William Evans 17
Sarah Farrier 25
William Farrier 24
John Williams 65


View
Original
Record

View original image

When I had this problem it was because the surname had been wrongly transcribed. Try doing a search for the first names and ages in Liverpool, with the occupation and anything else that could identify them.
My Freeman had been described at Treeman.
Of course it could be that they didn't take part in the census. I am still looking for my grandfather aged seven in 1881. The rest of the family are there but he isn't.

Louise

The births are on this site which is free to use, but the image i was looking at was on Ancestry which i subscribe to and thats £80. a year

http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl

Maybe who every took the census thought thet were twins cos them being the same age

1851 census Could this be your family?
Name: Thomas Emery
Age: 3
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1848
Relation: Son
Father's Name: James
Mother's Name: Ann
Gender: Male
Where born: Liverpool

Civil Parish: Liverpool
Town: Liverpool
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View Image

Registration district: Liverpool
Sub registration district: Dale Street
ED, institution, or vessel: 1y
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 192
Household Members: Name Age
Ann Emery 33
James Emery 35
James Emery 11 Mo
John Emery 9
Sarah Ellen Emery 7
Thomas Emery 3
William Emery 3

The fathers name is James but all other names appear to coincide. People did havetwo names and if th baby son called James died then maybe the father chose to use his second name.

Could also be that baby James was James Enoch which is why Enoch is not listed.

thanks again for all these responses.
known as - thanks yes the first one is def the right family and i have gone back since then but then got stuck!!
1851 sounds hopeful - john and james are quite often interchanged i think and his age just about spot on.
james 11 months may not have survived for next census, all the other names and ages tally apart from Ann - mother - who should be 28 - so maybe she lied on the next census?
can i ask how you found this because i have been searching all the names on the census records here and got nowhere.
thanks again so much
louise

Delving a bit further these are definitely yours. In 1861 Father John was Mariner/beer house keeper. In 1851 was licensed victular.
Do you have access to Ancestry.co.uk?

thanks again, no i do not have access to ancestry.co.uk. is this where you obtained your info? if so do you think it is worth joining?
i have just done several name checks on here for the 1851 census - thomas, john, sarah and ann and not one came back with a near result.
i have checked them all individually and not one came up on this site.
do you have any tips you could offer on marriages etc.
as in - could you suggest how i could find out about the marriage of john (or james) and ann?
thanks again
Louise

Louise

if you read my reply at 9.02 i have put a web address where Birth, Marriages & Deaths are free to look for

thanks julie,
i have made a note of it and did actually go to the site before, but (and it's probably me doing it wrong) i couldn't get a result.
maybe it the end bit of the web address that clincnes it.
i will try again, because much as it's brilliant to get all this help so freely given, and very very much aprreciated, the thrill is in finding it for yourself if you can.
anyway thanks again, i will re-try the other site.
Louise

Louise

Have a play on there i was the same when i first looked at it

Yes at present Ihave a free trial with Ancestry but have similar problems with that site when census data is transcribed in accurately eg Martin on GensR census site is transcribed as Marn on Ancesrty -all very frustrating particularly when you view the image and it is quite clear that a careless mistake has been made. Should you subsribe? only if you need to do lots and lots of research I would think cos the cost per year is about £80 although you can try negociating with them I would suggest taking a 14 day trial and working like mad to get all the info you need in that period then cancelling the subscription.
Ancestry also has more detailed access to BMD thro' the complete qtr by qtr records so could give you that info. Good luck with your research H

Whoops sorry about the typos!!

thanks again to you both.
known as - i think i will stay with what i've got for now as i think it could be too easy to join everything. i have also joined findmypast.com but had a bit of a prob straightaway there in that the files downloaded where huge.
Julie - i have done as you said and have had a bit of a play using the full address you gave me and i got to thomas' birth details straight away.
thanks again
louise

There is a useful illustrated guide to census searches on FTF.

It shows (via screenshots) actual searches using the ancestry site, what search criteria are used, the results that were found and ways to find family members who are mistranscribed (for example one year the index says surname of Gresham but the image is actually Chambers).


Worth bookmarking for use in the future.

http://www.familytreeforum.com/wiki/index.php/Census_Search

I didn't bother posting this last night..

Thomas and William ARE twins. It's just that William's page number was uncertain.

Births Mar 1847
Emery Thomas W Derby 20 1055
Emery William W Derby 20 10[35]5

Rose