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The Pullan family mystery!!!

My newly found second cousin has found out the following...

On Berthas marriage certifcate, she calls herself BERTHA GREAVES PULLAN, she also gives her fathers name as Francis Greaves Pullan. Often, maiden names of mothers are included in the names of male children to keep the name alive. I went to the Sheepcar records office to look at the marriage register for William Greaves and Rebecca Giles (Francis's parents) to see if Rebeccas name had been wrongly transcribed but no, it was quite clear her surname was Giles. I wondered if she had been married previously, so consulted the IGI and found her birth 9th Feb 1812 and William Giles, her father registering her birth. When I obtained William and Rebeccas death certs, the informant on both to be Mary Bedell, the couples first child. When I traced Mary I found her with her first husband Richard Stevens and their child Emma Stevens, also with the family, named as a visitor is a MARY PULLAN - widow, age 63 (1788 Wortley) on the 1851 census. Richard died in the second quarter in 1851. Perhaps MARY PULLAN went there to help young Mary nurse her sick husband???
When I tried to find MARY Pullan on the 1841 and 1861 census's it was inconclusive. Also Francis's older brother Thomas was also given the name PULLAN as it is on his death cert.
The age of MARY PULLAN suggests she could be a relative of Williams, but how she is linked maybe will remain a mystery.

If you can shed any light on this continuing story, please let me know.

Come on Janey, Dea, Joy, Fanny and others who have helped me in the past...thinking caps on!

Best wishes

Debi.x

Great pic, btw. ;-)

I've "met" (but not *met*) a half-dozen people, since doing this stuff, with whom I share grx2 grandparents -- in the US, Canada and England. Funny, since none of my grx2 grparents and only half my gr-grparents ever set foot out of England.

My mum's grandparents all moved to Canada so I know who all their descendants are. The one new descendant of the same gr-grparent that I've met through here -- we share my dad's grandfather, so our fathers were half-cousins -- wasn't interested at all. Which I found a little odd. We're the same relation as you and your new cousin.

Maybe what I now suspect is actually true and he knows or suspects it ... that the name on his great-grandfather's marriage certificiate (to his new wife after my gr-grmother died) isn't actually my gr-grfather, it's my grandfather, and he didn't die, he came to Canada ...

:-D

Thank you Janey!

YOU ARE A STAR!!!

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


ps. I've edited FB.

Sigh, you just keep on thanking Dea on facebook for finding your grandmother ... who was it who did that, again?


Name: Bertha Beckett ?
Birth Date: abt 1871
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1930
Age at Death: 59
Registration district: Leeds North
Inferred County: Yorkshire West Riding
Volume: 9b
Page: 347


That's from Ancestry.

It's also at FreeBMD, which is where you look for registered births, marriages and deaths, not familysearch.

http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/cgi/search.pl

Deaths Jun 1930
Beckett Bertha 59 Leeds North 9b 347

Hi all

I need Bertha's date of death please. Another tree has it as 1930. I have checked this on the free family search site and got nothing. I have searched on Gr from 1921 to 1931 and found nothing!!!

Please help

With thanks

Debi

I have put up a photo of me and my second cousin on facebook. Thanks to all who's research made this possible. xxxxx

Hmmmmm, wonder if dear Janey pointed our Debi toward Fans great Morris/Florence find that ..cough..."someone" was struggling with??????



Just to prove that Fans can "find em"as well as "annoy em" :D

:-) :D :-) :D :-) :D :-) :D

Cakes! Please!




Debi eating all the cakes

|| || || ||
v v v v

Certainly NOT Debi......I would not spend the flight money to meet HER.....

I am a bred but not born West Wales Woman and she is a Canuck in Canuckstan and long may she stay there.. :D

Janey and Fanny STOP IT or its the naughty step for you both!

I'm sure you two are best friends in the 'real' world and meet up for coffee n cakes...

<3

Sigh.....Yes Sweetpea it WAS a cow I fell off aged 8 and broke my left wrist so badly that the bones poked through,well us poor hill farmers daughters had to make do you know? BUT it knocked my teeth straight at the same time so no brace needed...Phew... AND I got the real thing(horse)age 10 after much pestering of parents...

It was being knocked off a HORSE when another bumped me and the HORSE(at speed during a race)that lost me my front teeth ,broke my right wrist and put my nose out of joint some years later,when I was 21 to be exact :P

FBG, we all know it was a COW you fell off in your youth.

How did that go ... 2 cow, 4 horse ... I'm still snorking about that one.

I have not actually offered any help on here have I,just annoyance?Didnt want to step on your toes did I ?

Well Sweetpea you worked hard and long on making sure you got your name in lights this time and it took some time so what went wrong???

I have been working "behind the scenes"recently and not courting the bright lights as you have;

Me?Get my nose out of joint?A horse did that for me years ago,have you never noticed when peering at my profile pic on FB......Awww forgot,my "real"profile pic is pre the horse kick in the boat race... :D

But when my new granddaughter is here (arrives for sure on Friday if not here before)and I am back from playing Granny next week BEWARE,,!

Hmmmmm.Off to dig up a few threads where I had to show you the way and sit and gloat to myself..:)

JANEY sensitive......????Now I have heard it all..! :P

When you put a long unbroken line of unbreakable text, e.g. no "/" or "-" in it, the system just continues it as long as it will go, without wrapping it to the next line. ... No, the temptation is strong, but I shall not experiment ...

Awwww, my name in lights.

You shouldn't've.

:D :D :D

I fear FBG may get her nose out of joint now ...

Looks like human error, I'm not adding their information, I always check out info given...even yours! LOL! Sorry just winding you up!

I have removed the dots, I wondered what had happened!

Check out facebook!

<3
Debi,x

Sigh, I think I'll go to the garden to eat worms.

Actually, I'm going to the kitchen to microwave a cornmeal & chili pizza. But first ...


1851 as on page 2

William Greaves 42
Rebecca Greaves 39
Elizabeth Greaves 18
Thomas Greaves 17
Francis Greaves 14
Jane Greaves 11
Edward Greaves 4
Sarah A Greaves 1
Rebecca Greaves 1 MO


Forgive my blunt assessment, but whoever is calling Francis's parents "Greaves Pullan" is just another of the Ancestry morons who put junk in their trees.

There isn't the slightest evidence that the name Pullan was associated *in any way* with the name Greaves.

Does that tree owner have any supporting documentation for that entry?

I'll stake my lunch on the answer: nope.

Don't be trying to collect on that ... I'm eating it now ... 4, 3, 2, 1 ...

JANEY! You are a sensitive soul!

There is an earlier status on the GENES FB page from me, telling everybody how fab the 'board people' are. So, of course you were included in that. I personally thanked Dea because I added the photo of Bertha to the page and that was down to her. I did generalize down the thread when someone asked and I used the word 'THEY'. I am very grateful for all your support and everybody else's on here. <3

Anyway, I went on the other persons tree to have a look at the Greaves/Pullan thing...now, I havent checked this out yet but they have;

#Francis Jonathon/John Greaves Pullan 1838-1892

They have his parents as;

# William Greaves Pullan 1809 and Rebecca Greaves Pullan 1812

So, another teaser...

<3 Debi. x

In case Bertha had a real father / stepfather named Pullan who wasn't with the family in 1881 because he had died, here are the possibles -- died in Leeds 1870-1881, of about the right age:

(editing to add details as I search around)

Deaths Jun 1871
Pullan James 50 Leeds 9b 309 (on the outside)
- in 1871 in West Leeds, brickmaker, wife Mary, children

Deaths Jun 1875
Pullan Joseph 38 Leeds 9b 28[14]
- in 1871 in North Leeds, unmarried, tailor - unlikely because of location?

Deaths Sep 1877
PULLAN Charles 35 Leeds 9b 263

Deaths Dec 1878
PULLAN William Edmund 38 Leeds 9b 369
- also in North Leeds, married to Emma, labourer in iron works, dau aged 1


You could try looking into them in 1871 to see whether they're nearby, what their status is ...

Of course, it's also possible (maybe more so) that Pullan was a stepfather whom Sarah partnered with after 1881.

Oh dear, I read your story on facebook on the GR page and I'm sad you didn't put the rest of us on the "team" with our name in lights. :O ... there isn't a "sad" face in these stupidicons.


Debi ... Bertha made up "Francis Greaves Pullan". She did that because she was using the name Pullan and she needed a father to match. Francis has no connection at all with the Pullan surname.

My (in)famous gr-grfather called his father Francis Monck on his marriage certificate. He did that because he himself was using the name Ernest Monck -- but his name was really Ernest Hill. He couldn't put Ernest Monck father Francis Hill (real father) on his marriage certificate (at least if he wanted to maintain his fake identity, which he did because he'd deserted from the military).

Bertha was calling herself Pullan even though she apparently knew quite well that her name was Greaves and her father, at least on her birth cetificate, was Greaves. So she called herself Greaves Pullan and called him the same thing.

There are thousands of similar examples. Wilks/Gaunt is along the same lines, remember?

Pullan comes into Fanny's life somewhere, and the options seem to be
- Pullan was her real father
- Pullan was her stepfather

Sadly, DNA won't help you -- paternal DNA can only be matched in the male line, son-father-grandfather and so on back. Bertha was a girl so the chain to her male ancestors is broken right there. Dang evolution, eh?