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1911 census - household transcription
Person: JOHNSON, John Payne
Address: 17 Thanet Gardens Folkestone

JOHNSON, John Payne Head Married M 48 1863 Marine Porter Lutterworth VIEW
JOHNSON, Alice Nellie Wife Married
18 years F 39 1872 Folkestone Kent VIEW
JOHNSON, Ernest Arthur John Son Single M 15 1896 Errand Grocers Boy Folkestone Kent VIEW
JOHNSON, Beatrice Victoria Mary Daughter F 13 1898 School Folkestone Kent VIEW
JOHNSON, Flora Victoria Christabel Daughter F 10 1901 School Folkestone Kent VIEW
JOHNSON, Violet Ena Alexandra Daughter F 5 1906 Folkestone Kent VIEW
JOHNSON, Ivy Lilian Maud Daughter F 2 1909 Folkestone Kent VIEW
JOHNSON, Harry Hector Obed Son M 0 (9 MONTHS) 1911 Folkestone Kent

I would certainly appreciate if someone more experienced could take a look at this one as there are so many similar names and name changes and I fear I may have confused Flygirl even more. I did actually put up a request thread for Evie Beavie to take a look at it but it was when she "left" the site.

I am looking for any record of John Johnson (1863) in 1871 census and 1891 census and any death record after 1911 if possible any help will be greatly appreciated Sorry for any previous confusion

As this has been such a confusing bunch of names I will map out what I have thus far:

18 Aug 1863 JOHN DAVIS born to Sarah Davis(1836) single Lutterworth Union. No record of father on birth record

Sarah Davis married John Payne Johnson Davies three months later Dec 1863.

1871 no record for John P Johnson (8)

1871 Sarah and John Payne Johnson senior on Back Street Welford
Joseph Gamble Davis(14) now going as Joseph G Johnson.
Eliza Davis (9) now going as Eliza Johnson Lutterworth July - Sept 7a 1 J
Julia P (8)* same age as John P
Joseph Johnson (6)
William Johnson(1)
All listed as sons and daughters.

* I have found no records either birth marriage death or census for Julia P. I wonder if the child was asleep and the incorrect info was written Bizarre I know but ????

1881 JOHN DAVIS GOING AS JOHN JOHNSON Single and working as servant at Mowsley Lodge Mowsley with sister Elizabeth Johnson (19) and her future husband William Parker (19) all servants for Thomas Jacques farm owner

1891 No record Although I believe he was still single during this census.

July 1893 married Alice Nellie Cole in Lutterworth 7a 19 No mention of father on marriage cert.

1901 Living in Folkestone Kent
Alice Cole (wife)
Arthur Cole brother in law (33)( cannot find anything on him)
Harriet Cole (64) widow
Ernest Johnson (5)
Beatrice (3)
Flora Victoria Johnson (newborn)

1911 Thanet Gardens Folkestone Kent
Alice Cole Wife
Ernest Johnson (15) grocery errand boy
Beatrice (13)
Flora (10)
Violet Ena (5)
Ivy Maud (2)
Harry (9 months)

How is a connection made you may ask?

Well when I got John Johnson's marriage certificate it stated Joseph Gamble Davis and Martha Davis as his witness and I traced it back
1871 Joseph G living with Sarah and John Payne Johnson and my John wrote his name as John Payne Johnson Davis on his marriage certificate.
Another connection

1881 JOHN DAVIS KNOWN AS JOHN JOHNSON is working with his sister Elizabeth Johnson at Mowsley Lodge
1861 Joseph Gamble(5) listed as a grandson of Sophia and Edward Davis These are SARAH DAVIS Mother and father

SARAH DAVIS (1836) is mother to both Joseph and John on their birth certificates.

So just to recap I am looking for anything on John in 1871 and 1891 under Johnson or Davis probably Johnson and any death record after 1911
Thank you so much for hanging in there.

I am sending this post today because I would like all at this site to know that I am sincerely grateful for the help that has been given. It has not gone unnoticed. Unfortunately I didnt understand how the site worked and didnt realize that the posts show on the date written. Unfortunately I broke the rule of posting somewhat similar info twice. Don't get me wrong it was my mistake and I am sorry that Janeycanuck believed she was on a goose chase. I have apoligized to her and hopefully she will accept my apology. She informed me her heart was no longer in "it" to help me and I accept that, however I hope others do not feel the same way and can and will continue to help my search for my family history.
The other thread has been deleted and now there is only this thread with all the info regarding my search.

As I live in Canada this particular search is driving me mad. I am tracing John Payne Johnson Davis (1863)
This is his name on his marraige certificate) however in 1901 census he went by John Johnson living in Folkestone Kent
His birth certificate 18/08/1863 states he was born to Sarah Davis in the Lutterworth workhouse. No surname of father. He was registerred as just John Davis. I am assuming the other names could be marriages by his mother.
Sarah Davis also gave birth to Joseph Gamble(24/11/1856).
On birth certificate no father registered again at lutterworth workhouse.
This Joseph Gamble shows up as a witness on the marriage certificate of my John Payne Johnson Davis as Joseph Gamble Davis. Confusing I know bear with me ok!!!!
I have found 2 Sarah Davis in the 1841 census living on the same back street in Lutterworth virtually next door to each other. One is born 1835 one 1836.
sarah davis (1835)
Father Edward 36 ag lab
Mother Sophia
Sarah Davis (1835) 5 years old
Edward (2)
could not read the name except that it started with an A (8 months).
Cannot find anything regarding john or Joseph after their births any help would be greatly appreciated. Anyone with any of these names please help I am stuck.
Kay



Edit | Delete | Add

I am not going senile just yet then,I KNEW I had seen this family before,just couldnt find it.
Thank you Janey.
Just a shame that a lot of the work was done all over again.

I spent a lot of time on this one but ended up confused and without a conclusion.


LadyKira
formerly Christine

Well well well.

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.asp?wci=thread&tk=1183506

For the info of all those who worked so hard in this thread.

Hi Everyone

I have had trouble repyling to this thread. Hopefully this reply will work my others have not.

I was asked the question what is the connection of Joseph Gamble Davies and John Johnson. He was a witness at the marriage of John Payne Johnson Davies and Alice Nellie Collie.1893

My only lead to finding the birth and family of John Johnson.

I want to thank everyone who is helping me with this mystery. It is very much appreciated. I know the hours I have spent on this and how nutty it gets at times. So a huge THANK YOU.

I sent off for the marraige certificate of Joseph Gamble and Martha Lee and birth certificate of Joseph Gamble at the beginning of the week and as I live in Vancouver Canada it will likely take about two weeks but I will keep everyone posted.

If there is anymore info to share I will be eternally grateful.
regards
Kay

Hi Flygirl
I am Susan from Help us to help you thread,you posted today.
If you click on the purple Reply at the top of the page a box will drop ,type your reply then press the purple Submit.
Your message should now appear at the end of the thread,you posted on my thread correct today so just do the same on this one.
I hope this is of help to you.Sue

nudge
I am a little lost on this one

No we have a lot of info but it still does not make sense. I have been staring at it for two days now.

I had a look at this and left it, but at the time I thought

1. John Payne Johnson married Sarah Davis
2. John Davis, who maybe took the name John Payne Johnson Davi(e)s, was Sarah Davis' son.
3. Sarah Davis had male sibling(s).
4. Thought perhaps Joseph Gamble Davies was a child of that sibling, thus making John Payne Johnson Davies and Joseph Gamble Davies cousins.
5. They were born within a few years of one another I seem to recall.

I became so confused that I didn't look at it any further.

Is this a possibility? Please note, I haven't looked at any of the census returns which have been posted because they were just confusing me, so maybe my thoughts are completely wrong!

(I'm not sure why discovering who he is, is paramount to the search)

n

my head is spinning now

I still does not work.

just realised I am still not sure who parents are of Joseph Gambel Davis

John Payne Johnson Davies
Births Dec 1856 (>99%)
Davis Joseph Gamble Lutterworth 7a 10

Marriages Mar 1887 (99%)
DAVIS Joseph Gamble Lutterworth 7a 17
LEE Martha Lutterworth 7a 17



Davis Percival Gamble Lutterworth 7a 6
Births Mar 1888

Births Mar 1888 (>99%)
DAVIS Daisy Jane G Mt. Harbro' 7a 10




1891Address: Back Street, Welford, Bittesby
DAVIS, Joseph G Head Married M 31 1860 Farm Labourer
Welford
Northamptonshire
DAVIS, Martha Wife Married F 28 1863
Yelvertoft
Northamptonshire
DAVIS, Daisy J Daughter F 3 1888
Welford
Northamptonshire
DAVIS, Percival Son M 1 1890

No I have only cracked part of it

Sarah wife of John Payne Johnson is the oldest daughter of Edward and Sophia Davis

1861
JOHNSON, Joseph Head Married M 52 1809 Agricultural Labourer
Spratton
Northamptonshire
JOHNSON, Elizabeth Wife Married F 50 1811 Nurse
Cottesbrooke
Northamptonshire
JOHNSON, John Payne Son Unmarried M 19 1842 Agricultural Labourer
Hollowell
Northamptonshire

1881 Address: Back Street, Welford (Northampton)
JOHNSON, John P Head Married M 39 1842 Labourer
Hollowell
Northamptonshire
JOHNSON, Sarah Wife Married F 45 1836
Welford
Northamptonshire
JOHNSON, Edward Son Single M 15 1866 Labourer
Welford
Northamptonshire
JOHNSON, William Son Single M 13 1868 Labourer
Welford
Northamptonshire
JOHNSON, Eliza Daughter Single F 8 1873 Scholar
Welford
Northamptonshire
JOHNSON, Mary Ann Daughter Single F 5 1876 Scholar
Welford
Northamptonshire
JOHNSON, Sophia Daughter Single F 2 1879
Welford
Northamptonshire

1891 Address: Back Street, Welford, Bittesby
JOHNSON, John P Head Married M 49 1842 Gardener
Hollowell
Northamptonshire
JOHNSON, Sarah Wife Married F 55 1836
Welford
Northamptonshire
JOHNSON, Edward Son Single M 25 1866 Labourer
Welford
Northamptonshire
JOHNSON, Sophia Daughter Single F 12 1879
Welford
Northamptonshire


1901 Address: Back Street, Welford (Northampton, Welford
JOHNSON, John P Head Married M 58 1843 Gardener
Hollowell
Northamptonshire
JOHNSON, Sarah Wife Married F 65 1836
Welford
Northamptonshire
JOHNSON, Sophia Daughter Single F 22 1879
Welford
Northamptonshire


Marriages Dec 1863 (>99%)
Davis Sarah Lutterworth 7a 39
Johnson John Payne Lutterworth 7a 39


Births Jun 1841 (>99%)
Davis Sarah Ann Lutterworth 15 150

Then we have the details for Edward and Sophia

1841 Address: Back Street, Welford
DAVIS, Edward M 36 1805
DAVIS, Sophia F 24 1817
DAVIS, Sarah F 5 1836 Northamptonshire
DAVIS, Edward M 2 1839 Northamptonshire
DAVIS, Ann F 0 (8 months) 1841 Northamptonshire


1851
about Edward Davies
Name: Edward Davies
[Edward Davis]
Age: 46
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1805
Relation: Head
Spouse's name: Sophia
Gender: Male
Where born: Lutterworth, Leicestershire, England
Civil Parish: Welford
Sophia Davies 3499%)
Davis Edward 69 Lutterworth 7a 4

We then have him in
1861 Address: Back Street, Welford
DAVIS, Edward Head Married M 50 1811 Agricultural Labourer & On Canal
...
Leicestershire
DAVIS, Sophia Wife Married F 45 1816
...
Leicestershire
DAVIS, Joshua Son M 13 1848 Agricultural Labourer
Welford
Northamptonshire
DAVIS, Hannah Daughter F 11 1850 Tuscan Weaver
Welford
Northamptonshire
DAVIS, John Son M 8 1853 Scholar
Welford
Northamptonshire
DAVIS, George Son M 4 1857 Scholar
Welford
Northamptonshire
DAVIS, Joseph G Grandson M 4 1857 Scholar
Welford
Northamptonshire

Joseph G Davis is listed as grandson (marriage witness)

we also have him in 1881 with as ? sister

1881 Address: Mowsley Lodge, Mowsley
JACQUES, Thomas Head Single M 48 1833 Farmer 161 Acres 1 Man
Mowsley
Leicestershire
CHAMBERS, Samuel Brother In L Married M 32 1849 Farmer 161 Acres 1 Man
Upton
Huntingdonshire
CHAMBERS, Julia Sister Married F 35 1846
Houghton
Leicestershire
CHAMBERS, Tom J Nephew Single M 7 1874 Scholar
Walton
Leicestershire
CHAMBERS, Alice B Niece Single F 3 1878
Mowsley
Leicestershire
CHAMBERS, Edwin E Nephew Single M 1 1880
Mowsley
Leicestershire
JOHNSON, Elizabeth Servant Single F 19 1862 General Domestic
Welford
Northamptonshire
PARKER, William Servant Single M 19 1862 Farm Servant (Indoor)
Kilby
Leicestershire
JOHNSON, John Servant Single M 17 1864 Farm Servant (Indoor)
Welford
Northamptonshire
CHAMBERS, Mary A Housekeeper Widow F 72 1809 Housekeeper
Elton
Northamptonshire

Hi there
Party over.
Last guest just gone.
They stayed over playing games all night.
Son just presented me flowers.

Brain is working again.

I think I have cracked it.

Please bear with me as I take you through stage at a time starting with what you know already.

Marriages Sep 1893
Cole Alice Nellie Lutterworth 7a 19
Davies John Payne J Lutterworth 7a 19
Married July 24th 1893 (certificate)

1901 74 the Bayle Folkestone, kent
John Johnson Age: 38 M abt 1863 Relation: Head Lutterworth, chemists porter
Alice Johnson 30<<born kent wife
Ernest Johnson 5
Beatrice Johnson 3
Flora Johnson 2 8 months
Harriet Cole 64
Arthur Cole 33