General Chat

"2nd or third gear at 40Mph?
does she tow a fuel bowser?

these days my mind is more on the fuel consumption than the speedo,

one complements the other.........I try to accelerate more smoothly, and brake a lot less.
on the overrun you are not using fuel, and am more aware of traffic and its distances and congestion.............I very rarely come to a complete stop at traffic signals or in traffic queues, I regulate my speed so that I DONT have to stop......
Bob

AnninGlos, Thats the same article that Jonesey posted the link for 8 Nov 2013 08:00

Roy

Interesting article in the Mail on line by somebody who has just attended one of these courses. One thing he put

Yesterday, as my wife entered a 40mph zone in Norfolk, I suggested she should drive in either second or third gear so that the noise of the engine would remind her of the limit — a tip John had passed on.

And, then, when she was preparing to turn right off a single lane across traffic I said she should not turn the wheels until she knew it was safe to make the manoeuvre. As John had pointed out, ‘if you do and someone shunts you from behind then you’ll end up being pushed into the oncoming traffic’.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2491840/The-short-sharp-shock-life-long-speeder-finally-slam-brakes-How-speed-awareness-course-changed-MARK-PALMERS-mind-putting-foot-down.html#ixzz2k3PrwAoK

Thank you Jonesey for the article.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YSr1ZT0PkE

I myself am dubious about these awareness courses. Poor driving behaviour is rooted in the pyschology of the driver ( something which the D.M. piece makes obvious ) and no one day course will change that.

OTOH treating speeding as seriously as drink driving would produce a step change. Drunk drivers are not sent on on drink awareness courses.

Although total road fatalities in the UK have declined slowly this has been mainly due to better car construction, air bags and so on i.e. accidents for vehicle occupants are more survivable.

Unfortunately the trend for pedestrians and cyclist is quite the contrary and for these people the UK has the worst record in Europe.

That is one very good reason for observing urban and rural speed limits - the difference between being hit at 35pm rather than 30mph is life defining for a pedestrian or cyclist.

The poor road safety for non vehicle occupants has resulted in the current generations of children haveing the least personal freedom in hundreds of years. There are any number of downsides to this.

More than half of those holding a current driving licence in urban areas of England & Wales do not have endorsements. So either (a) they are extremely lucky at avoiding speeding controls year in year out or (b) they observe the speed limits. I repeat "just a few miles" over the limit is not trivial and it is not inevitable and no everybody does not do it. THINK it could be your rellie wandering out into the road, not paying attention, iPhones full blast ...

France does not advertise national speed limits on motorways. It does ( as in the UK ) put up signs where there is a lower limit for one reason or another. Under French law motorists are automatically liable for injury to cyclists & pedestrians under the "no fault" rules.

To say that it is difficult to observe the speed limit just because the car "does not like to go so slowly" is fatuous and suggests the driver does not really know how to drive. Much the same can be said of "it was a broad wide road" and other common excuses.

Ask any highways engineer, ambulance man or traffic cop what they think.

Take a look at this article, you may find it interesting:

http://goo.gl/ce5GhT

Rollo, I am sure I have seen speed limits shown on French motorways, although not on other roads.

We go to France in a motorhome and sometimes pop over the boarders to Spain or Switzerland. Before we go, we make sure we read up on the motoring law for where we are going (both of us even though I don't drive) and have a mph/kph converter on the speedometer. We don't assume that other countries have the same rules as the UK.

France does not advertise its national speed limits at all and on top most of them are reduced by 10kph when the weather is bad. The gendarmes decide when the weather is bad. Limits vary a lot depending on the class of road and type of vehicle.

Enforcement of speed limits is very lax for the most part with random "crack downs" which make people fume and bite a big dent in tourist budgets.

A few years ago many "route nationales" ( A roads ) were reclassified to "routes departementales" with a drop in speed limit from 130kph to 90 kph. The only warning was the change in the road number on direction signs ... This was done to encourage people to use the autoroutes which are very expensive - a journey from Paris to Bordeaux costs more in tolls than fuel!

There is some limited signing of local limits but by and large once you have entered a "commune" the 50kph applies until you leave ( red diagonal stripe ). There are no repeaters.

On some autoroutes ( turnpikes ) the toll system might calculate yr speed since the last point and auto generate a speeding ticket.

In England there is no on-the-spot fine system for speeding so most tourists ( inc EU ) get away with it scot free. France otoh applies on the spot penalties. They take all major cards and cash ... no pay, no drive.

France has been slow to roll out ANPR type speed traps not the least because the French, like the Americans, are armed to the teeth and the cameras are a popular target. Typical weapons are 9mm automatic, pump action shotgun so it is best to take them seriously. Burglary rates are low ( why? ) though it is an offence to kill and maim burglars.

In rural areas driving licence suspensions often allow for the journey to work as there is hardly any frequent public transport outside of large towns. Suspensions for drink drive rarely exceed 90 days.

France does not have any kind of speed or driver awareness projects. OTOH drivers who are unaware soon have the fact marked by the many sad roadside memorials - the state has now resorted to black metal shades or silhouettes.

French road fatalities p.a. are well over twice that of the UK.
:-(

you're not kidding!!


why can't you be like other countries, and post the actual speed limit on all roads, even motorways?? :-D

here is about the best simple explanation, Sylvia, its difficult enough for us locals let alone you tourists!!

http://www.bedfordshire.police.uk/advice_centre/casualty
_reduction_partnership/speed/know_your_speed_limits.aspx

so how is the poor tourist supposed to know what the unrestricted sign actually means????????????????


If you have a map, it says the black bar across a white background is "unrestricted, but NOT what the speed is!

Yea Sylvia,
the maximum speed ANYWHERE in the UK is 70 Mph

dual carriageways unless posted otherwise are 70Mph
national speed limit is a diagonal black bar on a white background which applies on all roads.....
but
single carriageways vary, from 50 to 60 Mph unless posted otherwise.(30/40)......there are usually repeater signs for these roads..........small round discs with the speed on them......urban street lighting usually implies a 30 Mph limit unless posted as less than that......

MINIMUM speed limits are in blue..........usually through tunnels etc........

The problem for us as tourists to the UK is that nowhere does it say what is the maximum speed on an "unrestricted" road.


You, as residents, know this ................... by absorption??? ...................... but the powers-that-be must make a mint of money out of the poor tourist!

True Andrew....
Average speed is so ambiguous

If you enter the zones at the "Average speed" you need to be a bit careful
I usually set my car to " average speed" if I enter one of these
BUT There used to be a school question about average speeds, the actual numbers evade me now,

but the authorities( according to my police contact) wont say where the readings are taken from.........ie any 3 cameras......or the entire network on that stretch of road.........or even if that section is actually live..........or if there is any " window".

if traffic is moving smoothly, then its likely you are near the average speed, but if there is any congestion..........then the calculation goes out of the window, as it were....

the introduction of managed speed limits on motorways does seem to help keep the traffic moving. I use the M42 round Birmingham regularly and as long as you keep to the speed on the gantries the traffic usually keeps flowing. There are however speed cameras on most of the gantries and judging by the flashes I see, they are raking in the funds. I also find it stange how the average speed cameras that are so common now cause problems for a lot of people. The slow down to the speed limit as they pass each set and then roar off into the distance. I suppose they only release the meaning of 'average speed' when the NIP lands on the doormat.

Having recently bought a 1970's sports car as a bit of fun, it also makes you release just how far car safety as come on in recent years. No airbags, ABS brakes, traction control. You have to be more aware of other road users as the car won't do anything for you.

Andy

we were lucky that OH was not caught by cameras speeding on motorways around Manchester in 2008.

As visitors driving a rented car, we were NOT provided with any "rules of the road" ................

and honestly did not know that the unrestricted sign on the motorways does NOT mean that.

OH was driving at around 80-90 kph ....... based on the speed the traffic was going.

The usual speed here on a similar road would be 80-100 kph, depending on the state of the road, straightness, etc.

However, the actual speed limit is posted at regular intervals on our roads, so one always knows how you should be driving, and warning is given of any change in the limit.


It was not until about 5 days after our arrival that we went to stay with a friend who, in the course of casual "catch-up" conversation mentioned that he had been caught once by a speed camera on the motorway and since had been very careful.

That's when we realised OH had exceeded the speed limit at least 5 times in the previous days!

we were plenty worried ........... but seemingly we escaped being captured on camera ..................... OR the car rental company paid the fine :-D

I have one hand at three because I was a van driver for far too long and have to have an elbow out.

My invitation to a course was for doing 33 on an urban road at 2ambut I was glad I did it.

One part of the course involved deconstructing one of the road safety advertisements which made a great deal of sense.

I don't think I have knowingly exceeded the speed limit since.

This thread made me take a look today at my driving wheel hold and I drive at the quarter to three hand hold

I usually take care not to exceed the speed limits ,always seem though to get someone who wants to drive up my exhaust pipe . It seems to me like intimidation that infers I am an old biddy who needs to put her foot down Well I dont ,will sometimes remark to the air, if you want to go faster then Bl...y overtake .#

Not a goody two shoes though cos i have caught myself inadvertently sometimes going over 30 when accelerating. Our car too doesnt like 30 in 4th gear so sometimes its juggling to get it to poodle along at 30

For me this was initially just four hours of my time given up to attend a course I did not feel I really needed. Not only did the four hours speed by (within the safe and regulated limit of course) but I actually drove away (carefully) from the session feeling like I'd learned something. Admittedly some of it was a Highway Code refresher course, but there's a subliminal message of attitude and methodology that left me feeling like I had not wasted wasted half a day.

The facilitators running the courses were not the police and, (as they constantly remind you) they were there simply to educate and, hopefully, reduce repeat offences.

Good for you Ann, how awful for the widow of that man I mentioned to know that such a fluke as his hand position, killed him when maybe he would have survived otherwise. Terribly sad.

Lizx

forgot to say, my hands are always at quarter to three