Genealogy Chat

Hello, I'm tracing the Andersons from Tynemouth in Northumberland and have managed to get to Thomas Anderson (1838). Unfortunately this is where something strange has occured and I'm stumped. I dont have any sibling or parents info....... Ref: 1841 census when Thomas was 3 years old and its looking good to go back a generation until I'm confronted with 2 Thomas Andersons age 3, living in the same street (pos next streets). I have links......... I have what I think is a definate match in the 1861 census at the age of 23 Married to Jane (Son in law of head of house). I have links.............. I really could do with a bit help here if anyone is feeling generous. I just dont have the experience to work this one out.

What info.do you have about Thomas? For instance, enough to order his birth certificate? But then, how would you know which Thomas is the right one? How sure are you about all the links from the present day, working backwards? Have you got the right childen with the right parents, and the right people married to each other? J

Can we clarify whether the chap in 1861 is definitely your relation? No point in following his line if he isn't............... Incidentally, I can't see anyone matching your description.........any chance of a few more details? Reg

David if you buy your Thomas's marriage certificate it will give you his fathers name & occupation, surely both the Thomas's fathers on the 1841 census dont have the same names & occupations? Georgina.

It could be that the two 3 yr olds were cousins. I have instances in my family tree where they were all fairly close knit and lived along the same streets and often you will find two or three children (all cousins) being born the same year, being given the same name. Yes, it gets confusing! Anyway, that is one theory for you. I would suggest that rather than trying to guess at it all from the census info - you need to try to find certificates to order so that you have more concrete information to go on. For example, the marriage of Thomas to Jane. If you are certain that you had ancestors by those names then try to find their marriage entry and order that cert. This will show you his fathers name and occupation and it might help you then identify him on the census records easier. I would always recommend starting somewhere closer to home, say with your grandparents or grt grandparents, getting all their birth and marriage certs and from the info gleaned from there, work your way backwards, ordering more certs as you go and checking against census info. Hope that's helped.

This one from B.I.V.R.I ANDERSON, Thomas Christening Gender: Male Birth Date: 19 Oct 1838 Christening Date: 11 Nov 1838 Recorded in: Tynemouth, Northumberland, England Collection: Christ Church Father: Thomas Anderson Mother: Isabella l Source: FHL Film 1068908 Dates: 1835 - 1848

Until David answers some of our questions, I'm leaving this one........... Reg

I'm pretty sure about the 1861 Thomas, although I am definately sure from then onwards. Married to Jane and had a son in 1883 called Alfred. Their first son was born in 1861. He was called John. I think the marriage certificate is possibly the only certain way of determining this as both fathers were called Thomas in the 1841 census, although they did have different jobs. One was a blacksmith and the other a boatbuilder.

Right...........let's get some facts on here.........is this the family in 1891? Name: Alfred E Anderson Age: 8 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1883 Relation: Son Father's name: Thomas Gender: Male Where Born: North Shields, Northumberland, England Civil parish: Tynemouth Ecclesiastical parish: St Augustine Town: North Shields County/Island: Northumberland Country: England Registration district: Tynemouth Sub registration district: Tynemouth ED, institution, or vessel: 6b Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Name Age Alfred E Anderson 8 George S Anderson 10 Ralph B Anderson 13 Thomas Anderson 53 William Anderson 20 ALL born North Shields 1881 census Name: Thomas Anderson Age: 43 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1838 Relation: Head Spouses's Name: Jane Gender: Male Where Born: North Shields, Northumberland, England Civil parish: Tynemouth County/Island: Northumberland Country: England Street address: 25 Hudson St Condition as to marriage: Married Education: Employment status: View image Occupation: Blacksmith Registration district: Tynemouth Sub registration district: Tynemouth ED, institution, or vessel: 7 Neighbors: View others on page Household Members: Name Age George S. Anderson 1 James Anderson 13 Jane Anderson 42 Jane Anderson 15 John T. Anderson 20 Ralph B. Anderson 3 Thomas Anderson 43 William Anderson 10 1871 census Name: Thomas Anderson Age: 33 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1838 Relation: Head Spouses's Name: Jane Gender: Male Where born: No Shields, Northumberland, England Civil Parish: Tynemouth Ecclesiastical parish: Tynemouth Town: North Shields County/Island: Northumberland Country: England Registration district: Tynemouth Sub-registration district: Tynemouth ED, institution, or vessel: 7 Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 238 Household Members: Name Age James Anderson 3 Jane Anderson 32 Jane Anderson 5 John T Anderson 10 Thomas Anderson 33 William Anderson 9 months Reg

Yes, in 1891. Thats defo them.

David Will you please give full details for 1861.........the name of the Head of Household, particularly....... Reg

1861: Aged 23 living with Jane's parents I think. Head of household would be Jane Simpson. Thomas and Jane had just had their first child and this was the only way I could link this census.

Speculating................1851 Name: Thomas Anderson Age: 13 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1838 Relation: Son Father's name: Thomas Gender: Male Where born: Northd, North Shields Occupation: Chain Maker Civil parish: Chirton County/Island: Northumberland Country: England Registration district: Tynemouth Sub-registration district: Wallsend ED, institution, or vessel: 1d Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 4 Household Members: Name Age Elizabeth Anderson 10 James Anderson 6 Jane Anderson 15 Marjory Anderson 8 Thomas Anderson 41 Thomas Anderson 13 William Anderson 18 William Carr 65 Reg

You're very sparing with your info, David......... How old was Jane Simpson? Where was she born? Where were they living? Reg

OK......got them.............1861 census Name: Thomas Aderson Age: 23 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1838 Relation: Son-in-law Gender: Male Where born: North Sh, Northumberland, England Civil parish: Tynemouth Town: North Shields County/Island: Northumberland Country: England Registration district: Tynemouth Sub-registration district: Tynemouth ED, institution, or vessel: 7 Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 164 Household Members: Name Age Thomas Aderson 23 Jane Anderson 22 John George Anderson 9 Mo John Fonder 32 Lusfed Fonder 28 Ann Simpson 28 George Simpson 16 Jane Simpson 55 John Simpson 5 Margeret Jan Simpson 7 Ralph Simpson 19 So.......you need the marriage cert for Thomas & Jane..............at least you know her surname, so you can easily cross-refer the records on the BMD index. Once you know Thomas's father's name, you can be sure of finding the right one in earlier censuses. Reg

I have also found another possibility Name: Thomas Anderson Age: 12 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1839 Relation: Son Father's name: Thomas Mother's name: Isabella Gender: Male Where born: Tynemouth Civil parish: Tynemouth Ecclesiastical parish: Tynemouth County/Island: Northumberland Country: England Registration district: Tynemouth Sub-registration district: Tynemouth ED, institution, or vessel: 1e Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 457 Household Members: Name Age Isabella Anderson 35 John Anderson 10 Mary Jane Anderson 14 Robert Anderson 4 Thomas Anderson 42 Thomas Anderson 12

I agree Reg. The trace does seem to split into 2 distinct possibilities. Thanks very much for your help.

Can someone tell me how to go about getting a marriage certificate pre 1837.

The simple answer is that you can't........there was no such thing pre-1837. All you can look at are Parish records. But Thomas's marriage would have been around 1860/1.........that's the one you need. I'm not sure why you are latching on to the one born in Tynemouth.........your Thomas lists his birthplace as North Shields on all censuses. Reg

But you say they have just had their first child in 1861 - and he was only 3 in 1841. Its Thomas' marriage to Jane you need the certificate for, not a pre 1837 one :-) Update, sorry Reg I was still typing when you posted your answer.