Genealogy Chat

Is it possible to get marriage certs for pre- 1837?

I found a marriage for 1789, is there any way to get a cert for this?

And would that give parent's names, as modern ones do?

And what exactly are Banns? The 1789 marriage above says Banns were read out 3 times on 3 different dates. Did only wealthy people have Banns read out? Or was it normal for everyone then?

On the same subject, is there a date before which birth certs cannot be obtained? Thank you.

Registration didnt start till 1st July 1837 which will be found under Sept qtr 1837. Not all births were registered as it was the registrar who went round his patch seeking out births to be registered, lots evaded him for some reason or another. In 1875 it became the parents responsibility to go to the Registrar within 42days ie 6 weeks of the birth with a fine for late or none registration.
You may find baptisms before 1837 which will show the parents names but not showing mmn.
Parish registers for marriages are also available but didnt show the fathers name as they do now,sometimes the witnesses are family so may be a clue to the family.

Banns are still a requirement . basically each Sunday for 3 weeks before a wedding the intention to marry is read out with the names of both parties and gives the opportunity for any objections to be raised prior to the marriage . this is also part of the wedding ceremony when the congregation are asked if anyone knows of any LAWFUL impediment to the marriage taking place.
Registry Office marriages have the banns posted on their public board in the same way.

When i married in the Catholic Church we had our banns on show at the Registry Office as well as the banns being read at Church. This was because .at that time ,the Catholic Churches weren't legal places of marriage. We were married by the priest according to the Church and the in the vestry we had a short legal marriage ceremony by a visiting Registrar(pre booked at the time the banns were put in at the Register Office) after the legal ceremony then we signed the register that the registrar brought with her.

Today that doesnt happen in Catholic Churches because they now perform legal marriages the same as C of E.

Joe- I have a copy of a parish register around that time and the person who filled out the details entered the abode of the two people getting married which was pure gold I can't guarantee that happening everytime but as already mentioned the witnesses can help .
If the groom could write, then his signature might give a clue. Again this helped me trace my gtx3 grandfather by comparing his signature on his marriage in 1802 against his signature on my gt gt grandfather's marriage as witness in 1829......it did take five years for me to suss it out though!-jl

Thanks for the info on Banns Shirley, what is mmn? So it is true that even poor people had Banns read? So before 1837 it is a case of just hoping to find Parish Record entries and copying them by hand ? And the marriage for 1789 will not have father's name, so how is it possible to go back further?
Is that where the buck stops?
Can babtisms be found online or is that only in the local Parish records, which must be visited?
Wow Janet, patience paid off then, and some Sherlock work too. Unfortunately all my maternal ancestors were illiterate. Sad to say some still are. And that is no joke.

mmn -mothers maiden name

mmn is the abbreviation you will see for "mothers maiden name" Yes all marriages have, & had to have banns read unless for some reason there wasnt time so a special licence would be arranged. Banns too have to be read in the parish of residence so if both parties werent from the same area then banns would be read in both churches regardless of which one the marriage was taking place in.

Baptisms records will be held at the local Records Office for the area. Some baptisms that are held at the LMA(London Metropolitan Archives) have been made available and are Ancestry. these cover the area that was London in the 1800.s bearing in mind that boundery changes mean that some areas that are now London werent then so wont show.

With regard to Parish records for marriages .well people tended not to move around to much and often you can equate the marriages with previous baptisms found. Sometimes too a family member could be a witness. its just using your instincts when finding info

Yes, I have found some interesting leads with witnesses too. I am copying and pasting all this info Shirley for future reference, thank you. It's all a learning curve..Must local Records Offices be visited in person and do we copy the records there by hand from original documents? How does it work?
Thanks again,

Most Records Offices need to be visited, Some may do searches for you but will probably charge.
When you find a record which are often on fiche you can get a photocopy done for a copying fee usually between 10-50p according to size of the original document

Some records may be too delicate to have been coped for the records but you may be able to view them .usually in an area set aside for that type of record, it will be put onto a special stand on the desk and you have to wear gloves to handle. It those case you have to write down the info and can only have pencils in the area so as not to deface any document

Sounds straightforward, great , I am not in the UK but it will give my Auntie something to do, thank you.

I have brought forward some threads giving some advice about visiting records offices - for your Auntie :)

great Joy! :-)

You're welcome. Hope she enjoys herself :-)