Genealogy Chat

Hello,
The information I have so far:
Winifred E Harrison born 19 Feb 1903 to John Henry & Julia (Bassett or Barrett I'm not sure).
Married William George Fowler 1920 Islington, Middlesex, six children, five with MM name Harrison, last one MM name Bateman. this child was born just a year after a sibling with Harrison. All have the same father & mother.
Winifred & William were married and together up to William's death in 1969, Winifred died in 1972 and my aunt registered her death with the maiden name of Bateman??
What is going on here? I am trying to think outside the box, but I could do with some help, please?

Hi Jonesey,
Yes, all that info is right. My mum is Eileen 1934 and she told me (when she was alive) that Jean was six years younger, so the only Jean I found was the one in Leeds. So I ordered the cert, but it wasn't the right Jean. I ordered the cert' for Jean 1935 MM Bateman and it is correct, registered same area and same home address as my mum, but has MM name Bateman.
Remember mum telling me that she, Alice & Jean were evacuated, but their mum stayed in London.
Not sure what is going on here.

I have death cert registered in Islington,Whittington Hosp, islington 26/05/1971, sorry not 1972.

Yes, very odd...but I have found this side of my family very odd indeed, a lot of skeletons in their cupboards, lol.

The last cert that i ordered for Jean is def her born 20, Affleck St (same as my mum) 27/07/1935 (so mum told a fib) Father William George Fowler, Mother Winifred Elizabeth Fowler formerly Bateman......informant 'Winifred Fowler Sister present at birth 20 Affleck St' exactly what it says on cert.

I have tried for months to think of why/ how/what, but it has truly stumped me!!

HI TJ, it just seems to be you and Jonesy on the trail so far, and a good job you have done so far, in getting the story together. Thought I would chip in if you don't mind, but I find my head spinning.

Can I recap and get confirmation?

William George Fowler married Winifred E Harrison 1920 Islington. Her father on the marriage certificate was John Henry Harrison, deceased and mother Julia Bassett or Barret.. Winifred is supposedly born 1903 but gave her age as 19 on marriage in 1920. Bill and Winne had 5 children with mother's maiden name Harrison and a sixth one with mother's maiden name Bateman. Winifred died in 1972 and her maiden name was reported as Bateman.

The sixth child of Bill and Winnie was Jean, but she is not the child born in 1940 in Leeds, as you have the certificate for her. Jean is born 1935. Very odd that your mum should say Jean was six years younger than her if she was in fact only 1 year younger, the Jean born in 1935.

I wonder if there were two Jeans, one born 1935 who died at birth and another 5 years later. But no, that doesn't seem to fit.

So where does Bateman come in? Why suddenly Bateman after 5 children with mmn Harrison? It ain't right and there seems no reason for it at the moment. What was wrong with the Jean born 1940 in Leeds?

Have I got the gist of this right?

I hate and love mysteries. The problem with this one is it is relatively recent and the online records aren't there.

But lets not give up yet!

Love

Margaret

PS I'm surprised that a few sleuths have not taken this up for you.

Is there a possibility that she had a stepfather Harrison, & she found out later in life she was actually a Bateman?


Ozi.

Hello Meg,
You have the story right, lol.

Winifred def born 1903, I have the cert' 19/02/1903 White Lion St.

Jean in Leeds has wrong mother & father, so no connection. Def the 1934 Jean all the right info on cert' sorry, just remembered I have Jean's marriage cert' which would suggest born in 1935. Don't know why mum would say six years younger...I checked with my brother and he was told the same.

If you want an older mystery I have an old thread on here concerning Winnies mother Julia, lol....not finding a marriage to John Henry, lol....honestly this side of the family is pants at telling the truth (can't go into it as relatively recent i.e. my mum's era), so many mysterys.....think is it has made this side of the family so hard to trace....I can't even find a lot of cousins, because what I had been told was obviously wrong...but WHY!!!! would they tell so many fibs.

I'd appreciate any help/info that anyone can give regarding Harrisons/Batemans/Fowlers.
Cheers.

Hi Ozibird,

Harrison is on her birth & marriage cert.

Where was she born? Have you found her parents on the censuses? What about 1911?

Ozi

I am off to bed....sadly have to go to work in the morning :0( But I will check back tomorrow evening just in case someone has a Eureka moment.

Otherwise I think I am going to have to resign myself that so many porkies have been told, no one will ever know the truth!

Many thanks all, it is very much appreciated.

Night, Night.

Havn't checked 1911 yet, got to get my head around who to look for so many Harrisons.

But, if they were still in White Lion St, London...may have a chance...will check tomorrow when i get home.

????????????

Births Mar 1903
HARRISON Winifred Alice Islington 1b 385

Can't add anything much to this thread except to say I have a Bateman who appears to have registered her second child with a completely different mmn. Must be something to do with the name!
I'm currently waiting for the BC.

Will watch this thread and try to think of any suggestions.

1911 census

Without viewing the original, not sure about the household, but


HOUSEHOLD BATEMAN JAMES M 1881 30 Holborn London
HOUSEHOLD BATEMAN JULIA F 1885 26 Holborn London
HOUSEHOLD BATEMAN WINNIE F 1903 8 Holborn London
HOUSEHOLD STEVENSON FRED M 1888 23 Holborn London

Hello,
I couldn't wait to get home from work today....and everything that could go wrong, went wrong!! ha ha.
I will try to answer all the Q's raised.
Firstly Ozibird...Not Winifred Alice Harrison, I have the birth cert & marriage cert for Winnie and a couple of her child' birth certs.

Jonesey..Ahhh!! so Winnie (younger) was the informant, wondered what that mean't. Yes, it has crossed my mind that Winnie (younger) was the one who gave birth. She isn't the daughter who registered the death, that was Alice.
I haven't found any Bateman's, but I can't get back any further than John Henry and not sure where is from or age, etc.
No, I couldn't find a marriage for John & Julia, I asked for help with that one on here last year and we came to the conclusion that they may have never married.
The more I write this down the more disheartened I get...I have tried to find some of my cousins thinking they may know..I found one of Alice's daughters, but she knows nothing and said the family is just riddled with secrets.

Hi Choccy,

That is promising!!!

Winnie was born in White Lion St, which is Holborn/Islington.

It does say Winifred F, but could they have made a mistake?

Do you think this would be worth paying to see, or don't I have enough information to know whether this would be them?

On the 1911 census, the 'F' stands for female.

Not really sure if there is a connection, but came across a mother called Julia and a daughter Winnie .......

Hi Pauline,

I know that errors can be made, but this seems not to be the case, as one of Winifred's children has MMN as Bateman on her cert, when the other's have Harrison (Winifred's birth name). The Q is where did Bateman come from and why? All so intriguing and very frustrating as I can't go back get further :0(

Hi choccy,

Silly me!!!! of course it is for female, blonde moment, lol.

It is going to be worth a look at, not sure what it will tell me heyho!!

Many thanks :0)

Most importantly it should tell you how long they were married. That will be interesting.

Ozi.

Good evening Jonesey,

But, wouldn't her birth cert' say Bateman and not Harrison?