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The reason I am perseuing this Robert and Susannah Smith is because of a number of coincidences..
1. They came from Norfolk
2. Their ages fit
3. They lived on Ely Place
$. Their name is Smith
My ancestor Frederic Leake Smith (never used the name Leake in any cencus') was base born to a Susannah Smith in East Dereham 1800.
I already have a topic regarding him http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.page/board/ancestors/ancestors%20of%20frederick/thread/1217401?page=2
I just think that there are too many coincidences with Frederick and his family living on the same street at the same time as Robert and Susannah. This is why I am trying to pinpoint everyone's location at a given time, and to find more information on this couple.
Frederick had a witness at his marriage called Sarah Smith. I am hoping I can find a Sarah connected to Robert and Susannah.
All of this may just be a coincidence, but I think it's worth looking more into before dismissing.
Thanks again.

London, England, Births and Baptisms, 1813-1906
Name: Robert Joseph Smith
Record Type: Baptism
Estimated Birth Date: abt 1827
Baptism Date: 15 Oct 1827
Father's Name: Robert Smith <<Sawyer
Mother's name: Susan Smith
Parish or Poor Law Union: Shoreditch St Leonard
Borough: Hackney
Register Type: Bishop's Transcript

Address: Red Lion Street

Hello Wendy

I might have something on locations of Ely Place and Queen Street for you - there are a number of links but hopefully you can get a idea of where they were:

Here are the details of location for 8 Ely Place (just so that you have the location of Ely Place in Bethnal Green) in the Parish of St Simon Zelotes from the 1851 Census:

RG number: HO107 Piece: 1540 Folio: 90 Page: 13 Sub District: The Green Enumeration District: 3 Ecclesiastical Parish: Saint Simon Zelotes Municipal Borough: Tower Hamlets Address: 8, Ely Place, Bethnal Green, Tower Hamlets County: Middlesex

Here are the details of location for 12 Queen Street ( in the Parish of St Thomas) from the 1851 Census:

RG number: HO107 Piece: 1539 Folio: 355 Page: 21 Sub District: Hackney Road Enumeration District: 16 Ecclesiastical Parish: Saint Thomas Municipal Borough: Tower Hamlets Address: 12, Queen Street, Bethnal Green, Tower Hamlets County: Middlesex

HERE IS A LINK: http://www.dickens-and-london.com/BGChurches.htm
giving locations of St Simon Zelotes shown as No 11 and in the vicinity of Globe Road and Roman Road AND St Thomas shown as No 12 and in the vicinity of Hackney Road and Kingsland Road. - all these roads still exist and can be googled.

On this website :
http://www.census1891.com/streets-e.htm Ely Place is shown on Digby Street - see the next link (there is a map down the page)

http://www.londontown.com/LondonStreets/digby_street_48f.html/

Queen Street not so easy to find as it isn't there any more! However, see this link
http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=22748
and at the end of the 2nd paragraph it refers to John Poole, who built behind the chapel in Chapel, King, Queen, and Charles (later Hassard) streets. (fn. 57) You can see the chapel on the map near Hackney Road, so it gives you an idea of where the street was.

Suggest you try mapquest driving directions and see what it gives if you go from Digby Street to Hassard Street - and here is another link!

http://www.londontown.com/LondonStreets/hassard_street_00c.html/

So they are not just around the corner to each other - but they are both in Bethnal Green

Hope it helps

Janet

Wendy, youre right its not Ely St on the 1851 I posted, dont know what I was looking at!

I think its 12 Green St

Nudging this up with a request for the marriage of Robert and Susannah.....where and when please.
Also, asking again re 1851 census location for Robert and Susannah. I have them at 12 Queen st, not Ely Place.
Does anyone know the proximity of Ely Place to Queen st?
Thankyou.

So can no one find any siblings for Robert Smith, or any other children for he and Susannah?
I am also interested in the reasons why Robert would have himself coming from Hulston, and then from Bungay. I haven't been able to find any birth records for him from either, including parishes nearby to Bungay.

Ginny...can I ask where you found the 1851 census for Robt and Sussanah? A friend found it for me and it has them living at 12 Queen St., not Ely Place.
Same details, with Susan being from St Andrews Suffolk. She could not find them at all on Ely for 1851.

OK, I think I have sorted this out.
Jossiah/Jonas is the only child recorded here of Robert and Susannah Smith.
I see now that it should have read MALE for this entry..
1841

SMITH, Robt M 60 1781
SMITH, Susan F 60 1781
SMITH, Josiah F 15 1826 Middlesex ***
YATES, Charles M 29 1812 Middlesex
MIRES, Thomas M 15 1826 Middlesex

I still find it unusual Susannah having a child att 45+, but I suppose it did happen.

Ignore the birth year wendy quite a lot say that if the age is not given on the cert

jax

Thanks Chris. I was just querying it because that would make his mother nearly 65 when she gave birth!! It would also mean that she had her sons 20 years apart..
Jonah C1826
Jossiah C1845
Susannah C1778

Look at the marriage detail..Jossiah, under age, born 1845, married 1845...

Hello Wendy, the Marriage above was for Josiah, son of Robert and Susannah...

"Name: Jossiah Smith (Cabinet Carver)
Age: Under Age
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1845
Spouse Name: Susannah Rowe
Record Type: Marriage
Marriage Date: 12 Oct 1845
Parish: St Thomas, Stepney
County: Middlesex
Borough: Tower Hamlets
Father Name: Robert Smith "

This can't be right Chris?

The 1861 occupation for Robert is definitely Sawyer.

Chris

1841 posted above Wendy, not sure if the occupation for Robert should be sawyer?...

(must go now, as off to Mums shortly, her Birthday today!)

Thankyou very much Chris and Ginny.
I have a Frederick Smith living in Ely Place in 1841 and 1851, and was hoping that there may be a connection. Frederick was born 1800 in Norfolk. I would think that having himself, and Susannah and Robert, all Smiths and all from Norfolk living in the same street at the same time may have some connection. Can you find Susannah and Robert there in 1841?
Thanks again.

Name: Jossiah Smith (Cabinet Carver)
Age: Under Age
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1845
Spouse Name: Susannah Rowe
Record Type: Marriage
Marriage Date: 12 Oct 1845
Parish: St Thomas, Stepney
County: Middlesex
Borough: Tower Hamlets
Father Name: Robert Smith



1861 (next door but one to father Robert, with Susannah's brother Joseph Rowe inbetween!)

SMITH, Jonah Head Married M 35 1826 Cabinet Carver (Josiah)
Shoreditch
Middlesex
SMITH, Susannah Wife Married F 34 1827 Milliner
Cambridge (looks like Wisbech)
SMITH, Jonah Son M 10 1851 Scholar
Shoreditch
Middlesex
SMITH, Joseph Son M 8 1853 Scholar
Shoreditch
Middlesex
SMITH, Susannah Daughter F 3 1858 Scholar
Shoreditch
Middlesex
ROWE, Mary Mother F 69 1792
Shoreditch
Middlesex
RG number:
RG09 Piece:
245 Folio:
115 Page:
22
Registration District:
Shoreditch Sub District:
5 Haggerstone West Enumeration District:
12G Ecclesiastical Parish:
St Mary Haggerstone
Civil Parish:
St Leonards Shoreditch Municipal Borough:
Address:
32, Ely Street, St Leonards Shoreditch County:
London, Middlesex

Chris :)


1841

SMITH, Robt M 60 1781 (Sawyer)
SMITH, Susan F 60 1781
SMITH, Josiah F 15 1826 Middlesex
YATES, Charles M 29 1812 Middlesex
MIRES, Thomas M 15 1826 Middlesex
RG number:
HO107 Piece:
709 Book/Folio:
3/22 Page:
4
Registration District:
Shoreditch Sub District:
St Leonard Enumeration District:
Ecclesiastical Parish:
Civil Parish:
St Leonard Shoreditch Municipal Borough:
Tower Hamlets Address:
Union Buildings, St Leonard Shoreditch, Tower Hamlets County:
Middlesex


1851

SMITH, Josiah Head Married M 25 1826 Fancy Cabinet Carver
Shoreditch
Middlesex
SMITH, Susanah Wife Married F 24 1827 Dress Maker
Welbeck
Cambridgeshire
SMITH, Josiah Daughter Unmarried M 0 (9 MOS) 1851
Bethnal Green
Middlesex
RG number:
HO107 Piece:
1539 Folio:
362 Page:
34
Registration District:
Bethnal Green Sub District:
Hackney Road Enumeration District:
16 Ecclesiastical Parish:
Saint Thomas
Civil Parish:
Bethnal Green Municipal Borough:
Tower Hamlets Address:
12, Chapel Street, Bethnal Green, Tower Hamlets County:
Middlesex



Name: Josiah Smith
Record Type: Baptism
Estimated Birth Date: abt 1826 (3rd Feb. 1826)
Baptism Date: 19 Mar 1826
Father's name: Robert Smith (Sawyer)
Mother's name: Susannah Smith
Parish or Poor Law Union: Shoreditch St Leonard
Borough: Hackney

I think this might be the couple in 1851. Occupation is the same as the 61 census...Lawyer


1851 England Census
Name: Robt Smith
Age: 73
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1778
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Susan Smith
Gender: M (Male)
Where born: Hulston, Suffolk, England

Civil parish: Bethnal Green
Ecclesiastical parish: St Thomas
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England

Address: Queen St

Registration district: Bethnal Green
Sub-registration district: Hackney Road
ED, institution, or vessel: 16
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 93
Piece: 1539
Folio: 355
Page Number: 21
Household Members: Name Age
Robt Smith 73
Susan Smith 73

TY Jax. Now to see if they had any children.

1861

Name: Susannah Smith
Age: 83
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1778
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Robert Smith
Gender: Female
Where born: Bungay, Norfolk, England

Civil parish: Shoreditch St Leonard
Ecclesiastical parish: Haggerston St Mary
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View image

Registration district: Shoreditch
Sub-registration district: Haggerstone West
ED, institution, or vessel: 12
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 136
Piece: 245
Folio: 115
Page Number: 22
Household Members: Name Age
Robert Smith 84
Susannah Smith 83

TY Jax, at least that's 1 mystery solved.