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@Flick,

Example my Grans mother's maiden name is down as Chapman, surely this is her married name -no?
My mother, on my birth certificate it's down as Higgins which is correct, not Rowlands which is her married name.
On some of the databases I've accessed the maiden names of some of my family members give their married name as their maiden name surely this cannot be correct it's a mistake in the entry.
MY fathers details show his mothers maiden name as Chapman not Rowlands which was her married name!
Regards

You refer to certs for Ellen........which are they?

And what info do they contain?

What do you mean by 'real' maiden name?

What other sort is there?

I repeat........ask Mary what her mother's DOB was...........

And please say why you think William was born in 1869........do you have any documentary evidence to support that statement?

The only death in the Manchester area which is remotely close to your idea of when he died makes his birth ten years later.

@Flick.

Thanks for that.
I have certs going back as far as my Grandmother Ellen Rowlands (Chapman) but as far back as I have gone it only states her mothers maiden name as Chapman.
Other certs that I have for other family members give their mothers reals maiden names.
Surely it can't be that a Chapman married another Chapman - different family?
It's a complete mystery to me.
Regards

Hi Patchem
William died in Manchester, Leaf Street Hulme. At the time he was living with his daughter Mary, who was a caretaker at a bank and lived above it. I remember his very well as I used to get his tobacco for him every week & take it to him on a saturdays, I was 10 or 11 at the time.
I have traced both my Dad & mothers sides as far back as I can go but, my Dad gave me some false information which resulted in 6 months of work going down the drain.
There was another Chapman family living is Salford at the time of Williams supposed birth & I followed that line which turned out to be wrong.
1 of the posts earlier shows this Chapman family so I know that it's not correct.
My Aunt who's 80 & still alive (Mary's daughter) is 100% sure that his children were born in Sheerness, the reason is that the 2 sisters didn't speak for years because Mary accused my gran Ellen of pushing her off a washed up log on the beach at sheerness causing Mary to cut herself badly on some metal embedded in the log which caused infection. whch resulted in Mary having a disfigured hand for the rest of her life. My gran apparently denied this.
With regard to the BMD's I am a member of Ancestry also & have found some BMD's on there which are correct, I always come to a dead stop when it comes to Chapman.
Thanks again for your help

You can't hope to make accurate progress unless you invest in certs.

OK thanks.

I've tried for 2 years to fathom this problem out with no luck. Every member of the family over 70 who is still alive gives me different names for the same people so it's difficult to know which is correct.
What I have found out recently and checked out is that William Chapman's sister "Ninny" as she was called married into the Hammond family. They had a daughter called Emily who married into the Lomas family. I've traced this info back as far as I can and it only gives her mothers maiden name as Chapman no 1st names, so I'm stuck again.
Williams middle name is a mystery, my Uncle was called after him, Raymond Tranter Rowlands, I've tried tracing it back that way - dead end.
My grandmother Ellen Chapman the same thing cannot find her birth certificate. Some family say she was born in Salford but others say Sheerness, can't find anything either way.
Thanks for your help so far:-)

Could you buy some birth and marriage certificates (and death) so that we can work backwards with certainty?
Your parents' marriage, their births, their parents' marriages, etc etc.
Thanks.

If he died on New Years Eve 1962, the death would be registered in 1963.
Was it in Salford, or Manchester, or where?
Thanks

Rita does not have any middle name on 1936 index.

Hi patchem,
thanks for the info, this is him, he died New Years Eve 1962.
So his dob will make a difference to my searches.
Regards

Rita Chapman birth 1936 is correct, but I have an entry also with her middle name as Travis.
Again confusion as that is my first name.

I've tried confused.com but they can't help me:-}

Is this his death, as would have been born in 1879 not 1869:
William T Chapman
Death Registration Month/Year: 1962
Age at death (estimated): 83
Registration district: Manchester
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume: 10e
Page: 28

Added: No, this was Jan/Feb/Mar 1962

Wondering about this couple. She was Ellen Tranter before she married?

WELLS, Edward Head Married
7 years M 41 1870 Skilled Labourers At Sea VIEW
WELLS, Mary Ann Wife Married F 68 1843 Barton Lancashire VIEW
CHAPMAN, William Son Married
4 years M 33 1878 Skilled Labourers Salford Lancashire VIEW
CHAPMAN, Ellen Daughter In Law Married F 22 1889 Salford Lancashire VIEW
CHAPMAN, Mary Ann Daughter F 3 1908 Salford Lancashire VIEW
CHAPMAN, Ellen Daughter F 1 1910 Salford Lancashire VIEW
HAMMOND, Thomas Son In Law Married
9 years M 27 1884 Skilled Labourers Aldershot Hants VIEW
HAMMOND, Mary Ellen Daughter Married F 27 1884 Salford Lancashire VIEW
HAMMOND, Peter Son M 8 1903 School Salford Lancashire VIEW
HAMMOND, Emily Daughter F 6 1905 School Salford Lancashire VIEW

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RG number:
RG14 Piece:
24022 Reference:
RG14PN24022 RG78PN1383 RD465 SD3 ED9 SN94

Registration District:
Salford Sub District:
Greengate Enumeration District:
9 Parish:
Salford

Address:
193 Oldfield Road Salford Lancashire County:
Lancashire

Perhaps you could ask Mary's daughter to tell you her mother's DOB?

No marriage on freebmd for William Tranter Chapman

Neither Mary nor Ellen is registered as being born in Sheppey district (includes Sheerness)

These are Chapmans born at Sheerness, 1908 to 1914:
Births Sep 1908
Chapman Elvina Catherine E Sheppey 2a 1073
Births Jun 1909
CHAPMAN Edgar Sheppey 2a 1049
Births Sep 1909
Chapman Alice May Sheppey 2a 1038
Births Jun 1911
Chapman Dorothy E Sheppey 2a 1004
Births Sep 1911
Chapman Vera A Hope Sheppey 2a 2039

Have you looked on freebmd for info about the births of the two daughters?

What was the name of their MOTHER?

Apply for it on line to...........

www.gro.gov.uk

It will cost £9.25