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hi ann thanks did you get my pm he also put on 1901 census he was from ireland as mary died 1888

Hi Sheena,

No I did not get your pm..........you have the family on the 1901?

Can you post the details on here?

found it now

Which Mary are you talking about the mother?

mary fitzpatrick who married john isaacs twist in here they moved to newcastle inbetween 71/81 census and changed there name to prince

Sheena,

I spent ages last night looking for the family on the 1881!! Thinking maybe they emigrated or changed their name completely which is not unheard of.......but usually in the case of foreigners to sometimes not stand out from the crowd............crikey I wish you wouyld have said last night................so on the 1881 they are the PRINCE family?

Annx

sorry ann was concentating on mary i have found mathew isaac prince in a lunatic asylum in 1891 wonder if he did something in middlesex and hence the move and change of name johns mother remarried in 1851 to a man called prince so they must of pinched the name

mathew was the youngest and last child of mary n john

Well Sheena, what a mystery.........have found them all now and John on the 1911.......looked at the original and def says birthplace Ireland.

Why?????

I would take a guess that he would not be familiar with irish parish names and knew that name from his wife...........it is worth a try.

Why change their name from isaacs..........what/who were they hiding from.

I wonder did the older children revert back.........it must have been very odd for them being called by a different surname.

my gran was born in 1919 and brought up a strict catholic her mother married a non catholic and he coverted john the one on here was a really strict catholic?????? but......he was jewish and mary was catholic told you this family was a mystery

1829-1992: minutes, case books, registers, accounts, superintendent reports, staff salaries and wages books, plans and photographs incl predecessor asylums
Repository Tyne and Wear Archives Service
Record Reference HO.SN link to online catalogue
NRA catalogue reference NRA 23842 St Nicholas

Scope 1865: superintendents diary/case book
Repository Royal College of Physicians of Edinburgh
Record Reference page 39
NRA catalogue reference NRA 16015 Coll of Physicians

These are the records relating to the lunatic asylum, I would ring Tyne & Wear Archives with approx dates and have them look him up. Could be he was born with difficulties, or maybe another reason why he was admitted.

thanks again ann
i will def have to call in to the archives maybe a reason for the move disabilities was frowned on then i think i did hear a whisper of mental illness in the family

off to bed will follow anything new tomorrow
thanks

if you send for his death cert that may shed light on things, failing getting any info from the archives.

nite nite

census - household transcription
Person: PRINCE, Matthew
Address: 2, Percy Court, St Andrew, Newcastle Upon Tyne

Cost:
You will be charged 5 credits for a transcript and 5 credits for an image, unless you have purchased a subscription for this set of records.


census search results 1901 address search redefine current search
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth
Year Occupation
Disability Where Born Original
census
image

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PRINCE, Matthew Head Married M 27 1874 Slipper Maker
St Georges
London VIEW
PRINCE, Dorothy W Wife Married F 26 1875
Scotland VIEW
PRINCE, John W Son Single M 2 1899
Newcastle
Northumberland VIEW
PRINCE, Mary Daughter Single F 0 (2 MOS) 1901
Newcastle
Northumberland VIEW

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RG number:
RG13 Piece:
4779 Folio:
144 Page:
34

Registration District:
Newcastle upon Tyne Sub District:
St Andrew Enumeration District:
5 Ecclesiastical Parish:
St Andrews

Civil Parish:
St Andrew Municipal Borough:
Address:
2, Percy Court, St Andrew, Newcastle Upon Tyne County:
Northumberland



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census search results 1901 address search redefine current search
© findmypast.co.uk


Did you have this Sheena, he died shortly afterwards. Seems that for whatever reasons he was in the lunatic asylum he did not end his days there.

cheers ann
archives have the records and sent me the info i need to view them so will def be taking a trip to view when i get the kids back to school

Hi Sheena,

Any developments today re mary's birthplace?

I forgot to ask yesterday how you came to find out they changed the family name........do you know for a fact that she didn't just take up with a John Prince?

Annx

some kind person on here found the link in the census as all the children were born in middlesex and all were on the same census here not a fact i know but as i have done the tree up till then well nearly all names seem to fit
still trying with mary not getting nowhere tho all irish sites ive been on and searched shes not there was trying mallow as her husband put on 1911 census it is in cork so going with that route at the minite been searching all day hope she didnt run off with someone else .......
sheena xx

dont know if im barking up the wrong tree here i have just been sent 1911 census the one with john sayin mallow ireland he is married to a sarah bmd marriage that fits says john charlton prince never heard off that one i have a death match for him in 1918 i wonder if he was loopy or im getting lost haha

Hi Sheena,

I think you may be missing my point or I am not being clear enough lol!

I do not think for one minute that the family PRINCE is not your family, but it does raise questions as to why they would change their family name after living as Isaacs for so long in the UK.

What i mean is, could Mary have by coincidence met and lived with another John .......not married him (as many never did) but to save face changed all the childrens names to appear as a legit "family".

Did you check this out??????


John Isaacs DEATH 1879 aged 46 Chelsea Middlesex.

OMG another twist occupations are the same ???he was a slipper maker so was kids.... johns mam remarried a prince poss she could off gone away with one of his relatives???? but strange i dunno getting really mixed up now and the prince his mam married was a german would her daughter in law do that
ready to scream now haha
x