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Susan...oops.......JAMES GREGSON may have been illegitimate......baptised 01.12.1806 Longford derbyshire..........son of Martha Gregson.......

Thanks so much Derek.......Wouldn't be surprised if James was born on the other side of the blanket. I know everybody has a few skeletons in the cupboard but I seem to have an excess of them !!

Information about James baptism is very interesting........but something doesn't quite add up here.........I need to have a good look at this and get it straight in my head and perhaps get back to you. In the meantime are there any details of his wayward mother Martha's parents ?

If the Gregsons have always lived in Longford I am assuming that there is more than one branch of the family. Perhaps I have them mixed up ?

On a separate note do you know where Dirty Lane is, this is where Mary was living when she wed William Rutland.

What would we do without your help ???

Susan :-S

Google "Dirty Lane Derbyshire"..............Ashleyhay..not that far from Ashbourne!

Thank you for your help Derek

Susan

John.thank you for your PM..have replied, but would prefer it if you could find your way back here.

Derek.

Evening Derek, long time no see. Hoping all is well

Thanks LA..very well..driven to working on Rootschat cos nobody wants me on here!!.......

Derek.

I do but my lot cause you problems :-D :-D :-D.

I am a problem solver!!!! xx

Well we have solved a good few haven't we.

Hi Derek,

I need you!! Dare I ask again about Joseph Stanley????
All I know is that he was living in Trusley at the time of his marriage to Frances Neal on 1.5.1701 at Dalbury. (After the marriage they lived in Kirkby-in-Ashfield)
Would you mind taking a look when you next go to Matlock to see if there's any more info in the BTs such as banns, and, if there are any wills for his grandson Robert Stanley (died Swanwick in 1813 & his gt grandson also Robert Stanley who died in 1853 aged 77-run over by a cart at night in Swanwick! Curious to know if the younger Robert had any children with his wife Ann Beardsmore. Would really love to find where Joseph was born if possible.
Many thanks-yet again

Hi , Assume you still havn't found any info on the Sison family

I now have the bitrh certificate for Hannah Maria Sison. Born 27.7.1857 [ registed 3.9.1857 ] no address only Ilkeston. Informant mother Hannah Sison nee Farnsworth father Abraham Sison , Collier

This all ties in with the details i found i.e Haanah Maria's daughter with her aunt Betsy who was Abraham and Hannah's daughter
This still doesn't answer why Hannah Maria lists her father as Edwin on her marriage, i can only assume the name was misheard and as she was iliterate she wouldn't have known
I have not found a baptism of Hannah Maria , but all signs are that they were methodists

If you come across any records for Abraham b 1823 i would be interested to hear from you
I believe Hannah Farnsworth was born in Gibraltar ? could you find any Farnsworth in the Ilkeston area who maybe her parents ?

Thank You
Serena

Hi Derek I think I have made a mistake and put my request on your private line. I was not sure how to contact you and clicked on DEREK. This Marsden family is getting a pain...my mother (granddaughter of George Marsden is now 98 and is set on finding the correct ancestors..My previous records were unsustantiated and proved wrong. The John Marsden/Elizabeth Singlrton line is not ours. Can you help? sonya

Hello Sonya..thanks for your faith in me!!!! i will try and make sure it is not misplaced............

I have a number of george marsden's born about that time..too many really, as you suggest........

The thing to do is..............you give me the GRAND parents of your Mother who is aged 98........therefore born 1914.....so i need her PARENTS and any older siblings...which will get me onto the 1911 census, from which i can work backwards......

So..the parents names. approximate DOB's and where they were born.....and hopefully any older siblings.........a census matching their birthdates will give GEORGE MARSDEN as the father of one of the parents.

From my initial study there is no George Marsden from Matlock........1851 is the nearest.

Give me what you can, and I can see me enjoying this one!!

Derek.

Thank you Derek. I deleted Georges parents and their ancestry brcause Neil Marsden who holds the main family tree told us that the George we were following was not our relation..he had the history for that one. So as I have no information for my George Marsden prior to 1871 census when he is with Emma Martha( Storey) and their (presumed) daughter Sophia ( same as Emmas mother) with no traced marriage I have no idea who his parents were. There were several George Marsdens in the area of his birth and date. I have tried to folow them through... most stayed in the North...one I could not follow..about the right age working as a Boots in a hotel in Liverpool in 1861. I would have given up but my mother Georges granddaughter from Robert Charles (killed 1918 in Flanders) is now 98 and wants to know her ancestry! Any advice would be welcome..sonya Mother Eileen Marsden b. 16/2/1914
Father Robert Charles Marsden b. 1879 Westminster
Mother May Whitlock born 1885 Salisbury
Living 108 Mile End Road. London Piano salesman 1911
I think this is ok sonya

Derek I did notice that when one of the daughters of George and Emma married she gave her father as George Henry Marsden,,(cant find it now) Sophia the first child was born Marylebone Westminster 9/5/1869 sonya

Hello Sonya.........Initial researches show that you have bee sold a pup by Mr Neil Marsden..

..if you Mother is indeed descended from George Marsden 1842 Derbyshire....and i have no reason to doubt that...then overwhelming evidence shows that Neil is wron..and not you or I!!......

GEORGE MARSDEN Baslow 1842 did NOT stay in the north of England but married Emma Martha Storey of Kentish Town london (no record found as yet of this marriage)......and had at least NINE children.all born in the Westminster/Marylebone area of london between Sophia 1870 and Jane 1886...........Including ROBERT C MARSDEN born 1880..........

The 1881 Census has George and Emma living with their first seven children at 87 Great Tufton St Westminster.the 1891 shows the two later children 1882 and 1886.....

George is a Cab-driver Groom throughout at least 30 years..all of which is spent in London.......

There is a possible confusion on the Ancestry version of the 1851 Census...the transcript shows George Marsden 1842 Baslow son of JAMES and ELIZABETH......but close scrutiny of the original show what looks suspiciously like JNO MARSDEN.............

I am slowly eliminating other George Marsdens born about the same time in Derbyshire..which is easy enough to do with patience, from their later records on the Census returns.....and i am beginning to think that we have the correct history all along..and for some reason Neil Marsden has panicked.....

Your George Marsden appears having been born at Baslow.then Bakewell..and then Matlock..but that is not a problem.because they are all within a stone's throw of each other..(well not really, but they are neighbours.)

I am now continuing along the lines i promised........until i am sure one way or another.

Derek.

Sonya........I have now eliminated all six vaguely possible George Marsdens born in derbyshire 1840-43...Chesterfield Flagg Belper Quarndon Bakewell......all absolutley never left the North of England.......and I have marrtiages and occupations for most of them...............

I assume that the Sonya tree on Ancestry is yours?............I can find nothing wrong with it at all..in fact it is excellent............unlike a few other COPIED or FILCHED trees on the same page that have perpetuated the innacuracy of George Marsden born circa1843 Baslow...and the George Marsden of quarndon being the same person..complete nonsense.......

I think the only thing wrong with the whole story is that we cannot find a marriage for George and Emma m Storey.and i believe you should preserve your Tree as being the correct one....Neil Marsden needs to show and aubstantiate his evidence to the contrary..........

Derek.

Are we sure of his year of birth it seems tto fluctuate from 1836 to 1843? I had another look at Neil Marsdens tree for which I am a guest and his George born 8/2/1843 married Esther Wright 1866 and they had six children from 1867 to 1878. His George died in Lancashire 1887. sonya

I went looking for that marriage on Bmd.s........no Emma wright to george Marsden....but there is no marriage on BMd's. for george marsden except to an Emma 1870 Chesterfield..living at dronfield.

I have George Marsden..marrying either Martha Holmes or mary Ann Mycock....

Your George has birthdates between 1841 and 1843...not much deviation..and anyway census dates are rounded up or down at will!