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Hello Jenny.....have finally got your LIPSCOMBES all together..back to 1697............big problem was the lack of Oxfordshire Resources....

Have been looking at your Tree..very impressive!! seems unlilley that you need my help...but am happy to add to the bits that are missing......on to the LIVINGSTONES !!..I've got it all..but is mindblowingly mindblowing!!.in terms of fitting it all together......

Derek.

Hello Derek, can you please take a look for the birth date of Richard Allcock in Duffield. I have him marrying Ann Kerry in 1793 in Spondon if that's any help.

Thanks

Well then Gooner..you only come back when you want something!!!

I'll present you with a scenario.......I don't think Richard Allcosck WAS born at Duffield...........and I don't think he was born in Derbyshire!!

I have the Spondon PR's which state his "residence" at time of marriage as Duffield........not that he was born there........and i can't find him anywhere in Derbyshire at an appropriate date......

ANN KERRY was batised Spondon 05.06.1759 one of three children of JOHN KERRY and ELLEN nee HASLAM (married 07.09.1756)

The Spondon records include a pretty good history of the Kerry and Haslam families....................but no children of Richard and Ann Allcock...................so derek in his inimitable way goes digging............

Their first child RICHARD ALLCOCK was born Butterton Staffs 1798..the very same Richard who married Elizabeth leeson at Boylestone and bred many kids there and in the Church Broughton area............

SO.........here is my scenario...Richard came from Butterton Staffs..moved into derbyshire..presumably Duffield..married his Ann and swagged her back to his own patch to have his wicked way with her..........a very common occurrence..wed on the bride's patch, but live on the groom's..................and Lo and behold we have:-

RICHARD ALLCOCK baptised 21.06.1767 Butterton Staffs son of Richard and Rebecca............

It's a possible scenario....not cast iron..but pretty compelling........

and i have found all the Allcocks of Boylestone and Church broughton.....

Derek :-) :-D ;-)

LOL Thanks Derek. I am having trouble tracing some of these Allcocks. Any info you have will be gratefully received. I have not been about much as I have had a virus for almost 2 weeks now and have felt really washed out :-\. i am on the mend now though so should have some more questions on this Allen lot. :-D

Hi LA....leaving the Gunners out of the conversation............lol..I have had really good shufti through the Ancestry Trees in an attempt to remove garbage.

In fact, one or maybe two are not bad..and you no doubt have everythinbg on Board already that \i am about to tell you.........except that I have the Boyelstone Records..so i can probably go further than others..including Baptisma Dates........if you get bore..switch off!!

First of al though..I am now able to confirm that RICHARD ALLCOCK was born in Butterton..and was the son of RICHARD ALLCOCK and REBECCA nee STUBBS..who were married 17.09.1766 at Butterton........the thing that more or less certifies it is Pallot marriage document for his marriage to Ann Kerry..naming Richard as his father....he was born in Butterton..but was baptised in Turnditch Derbyshire..Turnditch is near Belper, in the Parish of DUFFIELD!!.....

But there is a twist.....your Richard Allcock was born Jan 1768..baptised 25.09.1768.......Rebecca was already carrying him when his elder brother RICHARD !!!! was buried as an infant at Butterton 31.07.1767..having been born only a few months earlier.........so obviously at a time of great distress they simply named their next child Richard..and maybe it was that distress that took them almost immediately away from Butterton.........This is perfectly true and confirmed...............

OK. since Richard married ANN KERRY at Spondon 14.10.1793..you may as well have the KERRY bit on your tree.....

Ann Kerry was baptised at Spondon 05.06.1759 daughter of JOHN KERRY and ELLEN HASLAM who were married at Spondon 07.09.1756

John Kerry was not born Spondon

Ellen Haslam was baptised 28.12.1737..one of two children of John and Sarah.who appear not to have originated in Spondon.....

That'll do for now...........later I'll give you the baptism dates for all the children of Richard Allcock and Ann Kerry..

Derek.

Gunners :-( :-( :-( :-P. LOL.

Thanks for this info about Richard and co. I look forward to any further instalments about this lot .

Hello Peter..thanks for you PM,s.

here is some info from the 1911 Census:

JAMES SMITH aged 41 born 1870 London..Coal Miner Hewer
MARY JANE SMITH aged 38 born 1873 Sheffield...WIFE married 19yrs
George Henry 19 1891 Eckington..\hewer's filler
May 17 1894 Eckington General Domestic Servant
Alonzo 13.. b.1898 Eckington
HERBERT ARNOLD born 1900 schoolboy
Hilda 1902
John Joseph 1903
Selina 1906
Joyce 10 months old born 1911

Living at 168 High Street Eckington Yorkshire...........

..except that Eckington is in Derbyshire..very close to the Yorkshire border..and clsoe to Sheffield....so Mary Jane Bagshaw's so called Yorkshire origin..could well be Eckington..........I can check that easily enogh.

more as I find it.

Derek..

Hello Derek

Just call you Mr Fantastic eh?

Many thanks for all the info on my Lipscombes, will correct my wrong bits and add all your extra bits

Bye for now

Jenny

Hi Derek.I hope you can help me? my grandad was Bernard carlile orme 1906 from Derby.In the 1911 census i think i,ve found his family though i can;t be 100 % sure as his name is spelt with 2 n,s.The parish is Holy trinity st Barnabas.I just wondered if i can find out if any of them were buried here or if there are any living relatives.A tall order perhaps,but anything u can give me will gratefully recieved.I have photos of ppl without names ;-)

Karen..struggling a bit here..if you have the 1911 Census..and if he is only five years old..it will give his parents and their ages..together with an address........both woud help me..cos i can't find him at the moment on 1911

Thanks

Derek.

Hi Derek
Can you tell me what information you can actually get from the parish records
Peter

Hi Derek

I hope you can help

I am trying to find information regarding Fred or Frederick Perrill who married Fanny North around September 1875 in Belper, lived in and around Belper/Alfreton, was a coal miner and died about March 1911 in Belper.

Any help much appreciated

Regards

Chrissey :-)

Hello Chrissey.........I can tell you that FREDERICK PERRILL (alternatively PERRILL..was born c1854.son of William b1809 SouthWitham.and Jane of Thistleton Rutland..she was born 1823...........

They had two children..FREDERICK 1852 ish..and LUCY 1863.......

Have not checked these DOB's yet as they are a bit out of my comfort zone.......

I have not found the marriage of Frederick and Fanny North.except the BMD's give it as 1875 Belper....but I can give you some infor about Fanny.......

FANNY NORTH baptised 1855 at Swanwick derbys (date not yet found.......but her parents William and Ann were married at South Wingfield 30.07.1850..and ANN's maiden name was NEWTON..daughter of Abel Newton..

William North was the son of John North of Swanwick........

They appear on various Census returns up to 1901........and interestingly in 1881.. JOHN NORTH Snr is head of household..with his son William and dr. in law Ann and their family............exactly next door.. on Belper Road Alfreton..to Fred and fanny...........it appears that Frederick and Fanny Perrill did not have children.......there are none in 1881..none in 1901....but can't find them in 1891.

Hope that will do for now..will continue digging..

Derek.

Hello Derek

Boggle eyed!!!

I've got quite a bit of your info on my tree now - you have put so much work into it.

Off to bed as it's Friday now

Thank you again

Jenny

Hi Derek
Can you please search for any info on Joseph Bentley born about 1854 in Mansfield, marrid to Marian Hudson in Saveley 1878. Also could you find any info on George Hudson born 1811 in Staveley. I think he is Marians father.
Best Regards
Peter

Hello Peter....just happen to have everything you want....will give you details later cos i have to go out..but briefly\;

JOSEPH BENTLEY BAPTISED Mansfield Notts 09.04.1854..son of Robert Bentley and Elizabeth nee Davison....

He did in fact marry MARIAN HUDSON in 1878 at Staveley..haven't yet got the date........

The interesting part of your quest is the HUDSON family..for which I am working out a full history..for the moment GEORGE HUDSON baptised Staveley 23.06.1811..married RHODA HUNT 19.01. 1835..and had loads of children..and you're right..MARIAN was one.......but not according to any Census you've ever seen.......there's a twist....but you're right.....

more later..........

Derek.

Thank you Derek
I am pleased to here that you are researching the Hudson family. My surname is Hudson, my father was Kenneth Hudson the son of Mabel Agnes Hudson and Alonza Smith. My father was born out of wedlock but Alonza was his true father. Mabel's father was John Thommas Hudson son of Joseph Bentley and Marian Hudson.
Looking forward to hering from you
Peter

Ok peter here's the story.....firstly MARIAN HUDSON..was baptised 30.08.1857 as you know...........been a bit of a chase because on on the Census returns that have her as Mrs bentley do we see her as Marian and as Maria........

She was in fact BERTHA HUDSON and Marian Bertha Hudson.......

She and joseph had (by 1891) eight children including JOHN THOMAS BENTLEY 1876-1924..who married Mary emma Smith in 1896..and had six children..including MABEL 1900............

Now here's a curious thing, that bespeaks an unsettled childhood.......

on the 1901 Census John Thomas and Mary are living in Staveley with their family.....EXCEPT for baby MABEL..who is living next door with the Smiths and their family..EDWIN smith being Mary's father and Mabel's Grandfather............very odd!!

an oddness re-inforced by the 1911 census where she is missing from the family home also...........The other children by the way were......Janet Maud 1896/ Harold Edward 1898/ Florence Ada 1901/ Doris Annie1909.../ and Emma 1911.......

do you think that Mabel was rejected??? and was that a contibutory factor in producing an illegitimate child????

MARIAN BERTHA BENTLEY died in 1903.......

Now back to the confirmation you wanted about her heritage.....

WILLIAM HUDSON married HANNAH REDFEARN at Staveley 07.07.1795..theu had five chidren including GEORGE HUDSON 23.06.1811..he was their youngest.

GEORGE HUDSON married RHODA HUNT at Staveley 19.01.1835

RHODA HUNT was batised 28.12.1817 daughter of John and Elizabeth....

GEORGE and RHODA had six children including BERTHA.1858..who turns out to be Marian Bertha Hudson........

I hope this is interesting to you..and along with all the work I do on here it is as accurate as my Sources allow.......which are largely original Parish registers......and therefore to my mind solid gold.

There are of course details of siblings and other marriage that \i have left out......don't hesitate to contact me if you need more help.

Derek.

Hi Derek

Am seeking a Sarah Pope birth c.1818 in Hartshorne. Her death cert in 1887 lists her as being 69 yrs old at time of death in Ashby-D-L-Z.

Her father is possibly a William Pope who married a Susanna Hill in Hartshorne in 1810 (possibly a 2nd marriage) 1st was in Leicestershire.

Are you able to assist with this one please?

Many thanks

Carol

Hello Carol.nice to hear from you...

SARAH POPE..baptised Hartshorne 30.07.1820..daughter of William Pope and Susanna nee HILL.....William married Susanna hill 30.07.1820..

Sarah married CHARLES BRADSHAW (1821-1861)..not sure when..not sure where...he's a hard man to find.......but there is some evidence that he came from Sheffield.and other unconfirmed evidence that he was the son of James and Grace Bradshaw............you may or may not know this......

They had two children Charles 1850. born in London..and Benjamin b 1852 in Norfolk.so whoever Charles Bradshaw senior was , he obviously moved around a lot....anyway he died before the 1861 census.

By 1861 Sarah is alone with her two children in Measham leicestershire..a widow..and again in 1871 she is in Measham..but the children have gone.

Benjamin Bradshaw married HANNAH RIDGEWAY at Ashby de la Zouch 03.11.1873 and had EIGHT children.....details of these if you want them

I see you're in Oz.....so not sure whether you know the geography of Leicestershire.....but Ashby and Measham (5 miles apart) are very close..either side of the A42....and Measham never culd make up its mind whether its in Leicestershire or Derbyshire!!..and again..Hartshorne is very local to both Ashby and Measham.

Hope this helps.....anything else..just ask.

Derek.