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Gosh you're quick!

Can you just have another look at the marriage date for Charles and Elizabeth? I have a copy of the register entry giving a date of ? November, 1737. If you're 1717 is right they waited 20 years before having their first child.

I had the baptisms of Joseph (Great x 5) and William (by default as he was on the same page of the register) but not the others or the deaths so thanks for that. Were the deaths in Radbourne as well? They must have snuck back in when the Guardians weren't looking

Mary Millington might we worth a look if you're at a loose end (as if!). She and Joseph Bacon married, according to my copy of the record, 21/8/1774, both were 'of this parish' ie Radbourne and the witnesses were John and William Millington.

My Capenhursts are much later than 1696, Matilda (Great x 2) was born in Leicester c1834 the daughter of Thomas C and Rosanett Gibson. She married Joseph Hague in Derby in 1856.

Talk to you soon

Pam

Pam ..sorry....they were of course married at melbourne 21.11.1737...he was born 10.03.1717..baptised 1903.1717..silly me!!

Matilda Capenhurst baptised 30.08.1834..daughter of Thomas and Rosina.

Derek.

Hello Marion..can't answer your query just yet..but have uncovered something that you may or may not know about....a very sad story indeed...If you know about it the I'm sorry..just letting you know I'm delving deep!!

First of all Weston on Trent was never quite sure which County it was in..but for our purposes it was in Staffordshire..where JOSEPH NORMAN was baptised in 1816..his future wife SARAH COXON baptised Uttoxeter 1814...They moved around a bit becasue their five (?) children were born in four different counties.

You probably know that HENRY NORMAN had the middle name MIREHOUSE..after his mother's maiden name..and that he married JANE TOMLINSON (born 11.02.1848 in Derby) at Ashbourne 17.06.1866........
Their only son WILLIAM was born MAY 1867..Jane died soon after, clearly related to the Birth..she died or was buried at Ashbourne 10.07.1867.......almost immediately William's father had him baptised 18.07.1867...then little William died...

Henry remarried 19.07.1870 to MARY HALL at the Registry Office in Newcastle............
I'm now looking for Joseph Norman..who may have died in any one of four counties!!..Will get back to you.

Derek.

That's my Matilda

Pam.....Just to confirm that both death/burials were at Radbourne....

Have been looking st Mary Millington..but she was not born at Radbourne..so a bit of lateral thinking popped in...after a large Scotch!!..the witnesses at the wedding of Mary Millington to Joseph Bacon were JOHN and ELLIN MILLINGTON.....ok..so look for this pair on the basis they might have been parents..or one of them might have been....I came up with two possibilities:-

Baptised Leigh Staffordshire.22.05.1756 parents John and Ellin..or

baptised 16.08.1752 Chaddesden,,,,16.08.1752 daughter of Robert and Ellin........I don't think we'll ever know for sure....Chaddesden is spitting distance from Radbourne.

How about this:-

MARY BACON.. father Thomas Bacon married EDWARD HAGUE at Radbourne 26.06.1826.witnesses Hannah bacon and Andrew Allcock..........just thought that the name Hague may set up a quiver of response!!

SARAH BACON married Walter holland at radbourne 15.05.1846...witnesses George and Eliza bacon..

Night night|!!
Derek.

Hi Derek.
No. Jane Tomlinson died of typhoid & baby William dies of the same thing a couple of weeks later.
I presume that Joseph must have died around the same time & Sarah moved in with Henry, but the move to Newcastle remains a mystery. There were Coxons in Newcastle but have never been able to establish a connection.
Incidentally, Joseph & Sarah lost a baby Mary at a couple of days old, when they were 1st married in Uttoxeter (presumably named after Joseph´s mother),It looks like they were in the workhouse at the time as the death cert says "inmate, Uttoxeter" for the address.
They moved all over the East Midlands which is probably why I have never found Henry´s birth reg or bapt. which was about 1845. Mind you, his middle name is often mistranscribed & his 2nd marriage cert shows Henry Norman Mayhouse, which is why it took me 10 years to find it.
All good fun & thanks for looking.
Marion

hi derek have my ancester on the 41, 51 and 61 census is living in birmingham with wife mary born in fazeley staffs
john smith from the 61 census was born 1815 melbourne derbyshire
the 51 says milbourne would you be able to find him in your records
thanks zena
p.s. sorry about the name cant choose our relatives if we could id have picked someone with an easier name ha ha :-D

Hi Derek, I wonder if you could throw some light on this mystery. Emma Misden was baptised 19th January 1817 in Osmaston by Derby and her mother, Isabella Measding, was subsequently married on the 27th November 1817 at St Peter's Derby. Absolutely no trace anywhere of a Misden/Measding family before that time though Isabella was born in the County of Derbyshire according to the Census Records of 1841. Her birth date would be around 1784. It's my very very solid brick wall and I would be very grateful.

Hello Zena....I have Melbourne Parish records....and the Baptisms have SIX John Smiths....none of whom were baptised within 50 years of 1815..do you know his parents???

As you intimated..the name is almost self-defeating, because IGI have hundreds of John Smiths around and about 1815..in Derbyshire..but not Melbourne....

Derek.

Hello Helen..........I have found precisely the same Records that` you have...ISABELLA MEASDING married Thomas Hickham 27.11.1817..and is living with him in 1841 with their three children.

Iasabella died in Derby April 1850.

IGI give nothing at all on Misden/Measding..except the marriage above..and the birth of Emma.

I have the Osmaston bt Derby records and she is the only Misden in them.

The answer must lie somewhere in a variation of that strange name..transcription was very inaccurate in those days........she clearly existed..was apparently born in Derbyshire..under some name approximating to those above.....as you say.avery thick brick wall!!

I'll keep digging.

Derek.

no sorry derek i dont
but thanks very much for looking
i did think it was a long shot
zena x <3

You just do this to confuse me don't you!!

I'm not at all sure where the Hagues and Bacons you mention fit into my tree.
What I have got is,

Sarah Bacon, 1799, dau of Joseph and Mary marrying Edward Hague 12/6/1826 in Radbourne. The couple had umpteen children and I can track them through the censuses until 1861 (Sarah) and 1871 (Edward)

The Sarah Bacon/Walter Holland marriage is another mystery, given the 1846 date they should be on FreeBMD but I can't see them. I don't have an Eliza or a George Bacon in my tree (so far) and the only Hannah I have was born 1723.

Re Mary Millington, as you say, we shall probably never know. I'd read the witness as William rather than Ellin but the writing is very small. perhaps it was mother Ellin and brother John!

Thanks for your time Derek, as always a pleasure to talk to you - looks like another trip to Derbyshire needs to be pencilled in for next year.

Hi Pam.....sorry to be wrong again....the father Thomas bit belings to another Sarah.....and the old eyes are not what they were...

But the date I have for Edward Hague's marriage IS 26th June...and of course the witness Hannah Bacon must be Sarah's elder sister..

I don't know whether you have this, but just found among the brood of Joseph and Mary (Millington)..one THOMAS TRUEMAN BACON son of
Joseph and Mary bapt.17.05.1775...........and there were two Elizabeth's...04.02.1775....who died..and a replacent 27.05.1787

others were Hannah 10.03.1796....and John 14.01.1771....

If we didn't know that Joseph and Mary were married in 1774.it would worry me that they were still having children 25 years later!!

all the best.

Derek.

Hi Derek

Getting on a bit better now but would really like some help on the

Livingstone, Lipscombe Blackburn

front.

Realise that you are very busy - anything will help though!

Many thanks

Jenny

Hello Jenny....sorry to keep you waiting..have been in a bit of a mess lately...abd I have mislaid the stuff I previously found......no matter. except i have forgotten what iy was precisely that you asked me to find.

Anyway I seem to have got it all together again,and for a start here are the bare bones of the links between Livibgstone/Lipscombe/Blackburn.

The livingstones came from hampshire..the earliest i can find is JAMES..the father of WILLIAM LIVINGSTONE born Gosport Hanys 1811

WILLIAM married CHRISTIANA BLANCHARD (1814-1871) in Hampshire..and had SEVEN children..all with the middle name Blanchard..including DAVID HENRY BLANCHARD LIVINGSTONE born Gosport 1843.

David Henry married MARIA LIPSCOMBE at Lambeth Surrey 29.12.1867..I have a copy of the Marriage certificate........He died in Derby1910..David H and Maria had three children including:-

THOMAS HENRY LIVINGSTONE (1876)..who married EMMA BLACKBURN at Holy Trinty Derby 22.11.1879

Emma was the daughter of William and Emma nee jackson....

I have a photo of Emma in old age..and another with her husband Thomas at the wedding of their son Harold
I also have the Will of WILLIAM BLACKBURN 1st May 1891

I forget your link to these families.....but most of the phot material refers to the elder son of Emma and William..who i thibk was called thomas.

I have the full Census information for all these people......will get back to you later

derek.

Hello Jenny....sorry to keep you waiting..have been in a bit of a mess lately...abd I have mislaid the stuff I previously found......no matter. except i have forgotten what iy was precisely that you asked me to find.

Anyway I seem to have got it all together again,and for a start here are the bare bones of the links between Livibgstone/Lipscombe/Blackburn.

The livingstones came from hampshire..the earliest i can find is JAMES..the father of WILLIAM LIVINGSTONE born Gosport Hanys 1811

WILLIAM married CHRISTIANA BLANCHARD (1814-1871) in Hampshire..and had SEVEN children..all with the middle name Blanchard..including DAVID HENRY BLANCHARD LIVINGSTONE born Gosport 1843.

David Henry married MARIA LIPSCOMBE at Lambeth Surrey 29.12.1867..I have a copy of the Marriage certificate........He died in Derby1910..David H and Maria had three children including:-

THOMAS HENRY LIVINGSTONE (1876)..who married EMMA BLACKBURN at Holy Trinty Derby 22.11.1879

Emma was the daughter of William and Emma nee jackson....

I have a photo of Emma in old age..and another with her husband Thomas at the wedding of their son Harold
I also have the Will of WILLIAM BLACKBURN 1st May 1891

I forget your link to these families.....but most of the phot material refers to the elder son of Emma and William..who i thibk was called thomas.

I have the full Census information for all these people......will get back to you later

derek.

Hello Derek. I hope you are both well.

I have Mary Allen born 1841 Church Broughton, I think she married German Brown born 1829 Wyaston. Could you please try and find.

1. Her parents names ,I suspect her mother was called Mary too.
2. Date of her marriage to German
3. date and place of her death please.
4. How many children did they have as I have found a tree with him marrying Mary Wild 1843, so was Mary Allen a second wife ?

Thank you

Hello LA.....nice to hear from you..we're fine.thanks for asking xx......you must be desolated about CESC!!

Ok..they are two different Brown,s..the one who married Mary Wild in 1843 was son of Joseph....and even in those days would have been older than 14....
Your GERMAN BROWN was baptised 27.09.1829 at Edlaston joint Parish with Wyaston..son of John Brown and Francis..........

more later as i find it. EDIT....23.04....MARY ALLEN baptised Church Broughton 07.02.1841 daughter of CHARLES ALLEN and MARY nee GIBBS...........she was married at Church Broughton 01.03.1860 aged 19..to GERMAN BROWN aged 31.............heyeyay!!

Derek.

Thank you Derek, I believe Cesc going could be a bonus as he is now too easily injured. I will have to cheer on my second favourite Robin. My mini Gooners (2 youngest Grandaughters) love Wiltshire. Fans already at 2 and 3 years old. :-D

Gooner!! Just edited my message to include what you want!!!!!.further addition...they were both going strong in 1901.having had a total of 3 chikdren that i can trace....Sarah Ann 1862
Alice M 1872
John William 1875.............JW still with them in 1901 aged 26..

see below for marriage and birth etc ....

Derek