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Got to feed everyone ,,back later.

There is every possibility that it is George and Caroline going on a possible marriage ref.

Marriages Sep 1840 (>99%)
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Brown Caroline Sophia Shoreditch 2 347
PERKINS George Shoreditch 2 347


Alfred charles Watkins/Perkins daughter,my friends grandmothers name was Alice Sophia.

Does seem that way!

It appears on reading up, only the lower noble ranks were allowed the privelidge of being in such close proximity to the Queen.

Maybe the embelishing and just pure generalisation of the job gave her the title over time?

Tracey x

Two Caroline Perkins deaths in Devizes reg dist:


Deaths Mar 1859
Perkins Caroline Devizes 5a 70

Deaths Dec 1861
Perkins Caroline Devizes 5a 52



Thing is, with George Perkins and Caroline, it's pretty difficult to see any possible connection with the Court of St James or whatever it was called. ;)


Oh, Tracey - I'd meant to say that too - it's equally if not more likely, if there is any truth to it, that she was a scullery maid!

The statement that goes with the L in W list is as such...

"document does not include information about the women who served in the Queen's Household in non-waiting capacities, such as Queen Victoria's lady attendant (Baroness Lehzen), the Queen's personal maids (dressers and wardrobe maids), and the various housekeepers, housemaids, cleaners, seamstresses, laundresses (including body linen laundress and linen women), and the like."

It's possible the ancestor was a maid for Queen Victoria and not actually a 'Lady in Waiting' and the very job title has been embelished over the years?


Tracey x

You're stating the obvious. ;)

It's why we've been ">>>"ing the shoemaker bit!

I maybe joining late....but...

"Watkins line is descended from a Lady in waiting to Queen Vic and a court shoemaker that eloped together"

Surely George being a Shoemaker fits?

or am i stepping in too late here?

Trace x

Me too on Deas findings..

Name: George Perkins <<shoemaker
Age: 33
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1818
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Caroline
Gender: Male
Where born: Bromham, Wiltshire, England

Civil parish: Bromham
County/Island: Wiltshire
Country: England

I've been dredging through censuses.


1841 in Bromham:

Sarah Perkins 50
George Perkins 20 >>> Shoe Maker
Phebe Perkins 21
Caroline Perkins 20
Edwin Perkins 15
Laura Perkins 10


1851 in Bromham:

George Perkins 33
Caroline Perkins 30
George Perkins 4
Charles Perkins 2
Edwin Perkins 1 Mo
Henry White 15


If they're the people, there seems to be no truth to the tale. ;)


Don't see 'em in 1861, though, so there could be *some* truth to the tale, i.e. the name change. And we all know how common that was ...

Maybe, when he changed his name from Perkins to Watkins, he also changed his first name from George to John?

What do you think?

Dea x

There is also a Frank who could well be the Francis on 1861 and the other one on 1861 was Caroline who fits
with mothers name?


FRANK ALBERT PERKINS
Christening: 25 JUN 1854 Bromham, Wiltshire, England

Parents:
Father: GEORGE PERKINS Family
Mother: CAROLINE

Extracted birth or christening record

It's looking more likely don't you think?

Dea x

Changed his first name as well??
And there was a baby Caroline Perkins in the workhouse in 1861 as well.

Now you see my dilemma on the family?

BUT, Eliza Jane is there as well so 'what do we have here??

ELIZA JANE PERKINS
Christening: 17 AUG 1856 Bromham, Wiltshire, England

Parents:
Father: GEORGE PERKINS Family
Mother: CAROLINE

Extracted birth or christening record

Dea x

A 'clue' from IGI - Alfred's mum was Caroline

OOOhh er !! but that makes his father George, not John??



ALFRED CHARLES PERKINS
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Christening: 05 SEP 1852 Bromham, Wiltshire, England


Parents:
Father: GEORGE PERKINS Family
Mother: CAROLINE


Messages:
Extracted birth or christening record for the locality

Dea x

Interesting to note:

Alfred C Watkins in 1891

is the only Watkins in the censuses shown as born in Bromham, Wiltshire.


There are numerous Perkins-s in the censuses shown as born in Bromham.

Thanks Potty and Dea.
I had them on my list of very possibles,and you have both now helped to confirm that I need to send for the Alfred one at least.
Just that with 2 possible surnames I dont want to have to run up a huge bill for my friend,although she has said to do whatever I feel, its still her money.
Its good to get others views on it.
Thank you.

Don't know how that happened, Dea, but have edited it with a new birth

Alfred C was born 1852/53 - probably in Devizes

He was still a Perkins on 1861 so what's wrong with this birth for him?

Births Sep 1852 (>99%)
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Perkins Alfred Charles Devizes 5a 86

Dea x

Snap!! Potty! - In fact - 'double' snap as you have posted your message twice (tee hee!)

I won't add Eliza's details as you have 'pipped me to the post' yet again.

Dea x

Or this one:

Births Sep 1856 (98%)
Perkins Eliza Jane Devizes 5a 95

Have you discounted this birth:

Births Sep 1852 (>99%)
Perkins Alfred Charles Devizes 5a 86