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Help needed please!!!

Found my Grandad Leonard Victor Church dob 19 Mar 1917 Gravesend, Kent
Baptised Holy Trinity 22 Apr 1917 Dad Frederick Victor Church

The query I have is with his mother!!!!
Florence Clark/Clarke dob 1894? Gravesend, Kent
Living at 7 Union St when married.

Married Frederick Victor Church dob 1890? Chalk, Kent
At Christ Church on 16 Dec 1912.

Children:

Frederick Francis John Church dob 30 Aug 1913
Baptised Holy Trinity 12 Oct 1913. Dad Frederick Victor Church!!!!

Catherine May Lille Church dob 28 Feb 1915
Baptised Holy Trinity 2 May 1915. Dad Frederick Victor Church!!!!

My Grandad See Above (Although Dad died 7 Oct 1916!!!!!)

Sidney Church dob 26 Apr 1921
Baptised Holy Trinity 13 May 1921 Dad BORN OUT OF WEDLOCK!!!!!

Leslie Ernest James Church dob 1 Jan 1923
Baptised 21 Jan 1923 Dad Ernest James!!!!!

Kenneth James S Church dob 18 Sept 1928
Baptised 18 Oct 1928 Dad James Redman Stedman Church?!!!! NO MOTHER RECORDED BUT ADDRESS 7 UNION ST AGAIN!!!!!

Obviuosly the query is with the different Dads & whether Florence married all of them or can anyone find records of them?

Finally:- Elsie Gwenldoline Clark dob 5 Nov 190
Baptised 9 Dec 1910 Holy Trinity Parents William & Florence Clark!!!!
Dad Private Cornwall Light Infantry At 7 Union St

Hope some kind person can help me with my puzzle!

Thanks Jenny x

Hi, I know you like people to stayonline once posted but getting late! Will get back on tommorrow & catch up with post. Sorry everyone.
Jenny x

Cant find any marriages for a florence Church to any of the surnames but did find the following, not sure if you have it or if her, but name, area and age fits?? informant on it might give you a clue anyway??


Deaths Mar 1930 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Church Florence AGE 36 Gravesend 2a 934

Sorry for delay on saying thankyou but been visiting my newest member of family tree! My little nephew. Thanks for your help.
jenny x

Thankyou for trying to put Florences relationships in the politest possiblw way! I was warned offtracing the tree by family mmber as my grandad never spoke of them & had nothing to do with them when he got older. Only spoke kindly of his nan, who apparently always looked after him. Im still a bit confused about census. On genes I have to find a person & then find the census to that person. Are there other sites that can look up from an address then? If so how do I do that? Is this a service ancestry offers?

Im just starting out so all advice greatfully appreciated.

Yes. I too am clinging to the fact that there is less than 9 months between my Grandads fathers death & his birth, although with the track record of the other children ill never be sure!!!!

Was wondering if there is a way of finding out whether the dad was at home wen he was conceived as he was a soldier. Does anyone know whether there would be army records to prove this? Although if I prove he wasnt I cant trace tree back!!!!!!

Thanks for your help.

Jenny x

Does anyone have free access to the 1911 census please?

If so could someone looup who is living at 7 Union Street please.

For future reference can I only view census from an adress at another site?

Would solve a lot of problems for me if I could view the censuses from address rather than person!

Thanks everyone

Jenny x

We all have access to the 1911 census -- if we pay. ;)

You can search and get results for free, but viewing transcripts or images is pay-per-view.

http://www.1911census.co.uk/

select person search or place search.


The address does return results:

7 UNION STREET GRAVESEND Gravesend Gravesend Kent

but it's 10 credits to see transcript, 30 credits to see original page.

This is the only Florence Clark of about that age in Gravesend:


CLARK FLORENCE 1893 18 Gravesend Kent

If you search for people named Clark living with Florence Clark in Gravesend, it looks like her parents were Henry and Jane, and there are various siblings. (I double checked by searching for people named Clark living with Florence Gladys Clark, combining her name with one of the names living with her, and they all do seem to be in the same household.)

Oh, and guess what. I used "7 Union Street" in Kent for "residential place", and it returned the same household!

Well ... you do need to try it out yourself, but since I'm there ...


CLARK JANE 1867 44 Gravesend Kent
CLARK HENRY 1869 42 Gravesend Kent
CLARK HENRY 1889 22 Gravesend Kent
CLARK FLORENCE 1893 18 Gravesend Kent
CLARK AMY 1901 10 Gravesend Kent
CLARK ELSIE 1903 8 Gravesend Kent
CLARK DORIS 1905 6 Gravesend Kent
CLARK GLADYS 1908 3 Gravesend Kent
CLARK MARY 1910 5 MONTHS Gravesend Kent

Thanks ever so much for your help everyone.

Its definately my Florence Clark & Jane was her Mum, although dont have any details on her yet.

However on her baptism & marriage records at medway city ark it says her father was John George Clarke (with an E). Living at 42 Peppercroft Street, Milton, Gravesend, Kent at baptism. He was a labourer on batism & painter on daughters marriage.
So need to investigate further.

Florence had quite a colourful life. Had children by different Dads, so its possible that her mother may have had more than 1 partner too!

Can anyone tell me how much credits are please? Does the site take credit card details or how do you purchase credits? If credit card is the site safe?

Still learning so I apologise if these questions seem silly but im fairly new to all this.

Jenny x

Thanks. ill take a look on site & find out libraries.

Jenny x

Checked the 1901 census for you, and this is the family, in Milton, Kent:

John G Clarke 32
Jane Clarke 33
Henry J Clarke 12
Florence Clarke 6
May B Clarke 5
Frederick Clarke 3
Amy Clarke 1
John Clarke 10

So indeed, John George it is. You should definitely look at the original image for the 1911 to see what's up. John G's age matches "Henry" in 1911 - a year younger than Jane. There may be a transcription error of some sort.

John G in 1901 is a house painter, born in Luton, Kent, so you can check the 1911 against that, too.

Thanks for letting me know that Luton is on medway city ark! I had no idea.
Jenny x

Hi Everyone,
Still tying myself in knots trying to prove this one! I dont have access to looking up census via address only person. So I was wondering if anyone who does could look up 7 Union Street on the earlier censuses to see if Florences Dad is still at that address & what name he has? Is it John George Clark/e or John Henry Clark/e? dob 1869 Luton? 1901 census looked up by person says head John G but someone looked up 1911 & says Henry but dob is the same? I cant see the record to see if its an error from the original transcript!
On Florences baptism parents are John George & Ann Clark but on marriage it says John Henry Father but there are two witnesses J.G & J.H Clark. (Although this could be the mother because her name is JANE!!!!)
Address is 15 Ifield Street at time of Florences baptism(19 Feb 1893) Address is 7 Union St at time of marriage.

This is really getting to me now! Does anyone have any helpful ideas that might be a way forward? Just cant seem to move on this. Also there is another Florence living at 13 Union St Age 1 est dob 1890 on 1891 census which is making it more confusing to me!. She is still there in 1901 census but the older man & woman dont appear to be Henry Clarke & Ellen Clarke (possible nee Parfitt).

Would be greatful for any help in solving this for me!

Jenny x

That can be done at the official 1901 census site - search by address.

http://www.1901censusonline.com/search.asp?wci=ad_search

It's pay per view, however, so unless someone has spare credits ...


This address does show as occupied (just search for Union, Gravesend):

7 Union St Y Kent Milton Christ Church Gravesend Gravesend Milton Next Gravesend

Jenny ... that was a waste of my time, eh?

I already gave you the details of the 1901 household.

I've checked the image again. The address is

42 Peppercroft St

Again, the household details are:

John G Clarke 32
Jane Clarke 33
Henry J Clarke 12
Florence Clarke 6
May B Clarke 5
Frederick Clarke 3
Amy Clarke 1
John Clarke 10

The same as the household details for 1911 for the parents and eldest child, Florence, except for the father's name.

Have you actually viewed the 1911 image?

I don't understand this:

"She is still there in 1901 census but the older man & woman dont appear to be Henry Clarke & Ellen Clarke (possible nee Parfitt)."


1901

Alfred J Clarke 38 - Beerhouse keeper
Ellen A Clarke 33
Ellen A Clarke 13
Florence Clarke 11
Alfred Clarke 9
Amelia Clarke 5
- address: Kentish Hotel beerhouse, Hawthorn St

This must be that Florence in 1891:

Alfred J Clark 28 - general laborer
Amelia A Clark 22
Ellen A Clark 3
Florance E Clark 7/12
- address 81 Charlotte St, Milton

Births Dec 1890
Clark Florence Elizabeth Milton 2a 795


1891:

Mary Ann Parfitt 42
Kate Parfitt 23
Henry Parfitt 17
Henry Clarke 28 - cement labourer, boarder
Ellen Clarke 19 - "
Florence Clarke 1 - "
- address 13 Union St


They aren't the same Florence.

No That wasnt a waste of time at all. As I said before thank you.

Im now trying to trace Florences father back further to maybe get his parents & Unless I know for sure whether its John George or John Henry I dont know which way to go! I could be adding people to my tree that are not even my family members, so I have politely asked if anyone knows if there is another way of me looking at this to get a confirmation in some way. Or if there is maybe another piece of the jigsaw that more experienced researchers know of that can help me confirm this. I have looked on medway city ark under luton but so far havnt found John George & dont want to follow that lead if its wrong.

I apologise to everyone if I have offended anyone but as Ive said in previous posts im politely asking for help! What I wasnt expecting was someone being that abrupt with me. When you are learning you are looking for help & support to point you in the right direction when you get stuck. I would hope that people would see from reading my post that im new to this & apart from censuses, baptisms, marriages I dont know where else to look.

Sorry once again. I hope that everyone will understand that I wasnt trying to backtrack just move forward.

Thanks again.

Jenny x

Note the edits to my preceding post.

Those are two different Florences, and neither one appears to be yours!